Page 1 of 18 1 2 3 11 ... Last
Results 1 to 20 of 342

Thread: I agree with Schumacher !!!

  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ashby de la Zouch LE67
    Age
    68
    Posts
    1,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    817

    Default I agree with Schumacher !!!

    Michael Schumacher states the following regarding the current Pirrelli GP tyres

    "It's unsatisfying and not what a Formula 1 event should be."

    Schumacher finished 10th in Sunday's Bahrain Grand Prix, which was marked by the highest tyre degradation of the season so far.


    The seven-time champion added: "If 80 or 90% complain, maybe Pirelli should think about it.


    "I don't think it is right only one or two teams can handle it and the rest struggle so much."


    Of the front-running cars, Schumacher's Mercedes has among the highest tyre usage.


    The team struggled to varying degrees in the first two races in Australia and Malaysia, before coming good in China last weekend, only to suffer again in Bahrain.

    I am not sure of his exact motives, but do I agree with him that the tyre's are not suitable for the extraction of maximum car-driver performance, there are too many limiting factors to be considered to allow 'flat out racing'

    Silly soft tyres that can be ruined in one lap.


  2. #2
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Pull off the A140 at Mendlesham, stop at the house on the left and ask for Steve. He'll guide you.
    Posts
    4,661
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    204912

    Default

    Tyre management is a skill. Schumacher drove during the period (was it 2004 or 2005?) where you weren't allowed to change your tyres. Did he have the same problem then?

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ashby de la Zouch LE67
    Age
    68
    Posts
    1,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    817

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tomtom94 View Post
    Tyre management is a skill. Schumacher drove during the period (was it 2004 or 2005?) where you weren't allowed to change your tyres. Did he have the same problem then?
    Agreed, tyre management is certainly a skill, but at the moment its affecting the ability of the driver to actually race effectively without having to give too much consideration to tyre issues, IMHO races are being ruined by inadequate tyres.

    Last edited by ErnieBecclestone; 23/04/2012 at 01:04 PM.

  4. #4
    Moderator
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    The North West
    Posts
    9,460
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    1588478

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tomtom94 View Post
    Tyre management is a skill. Schumacher drove during the period (was it 2004 or 2005?) where you weren't allowed to change your tyres. Did he have the same problem then?
    I agree it is an important skill, but its dangerously close to being relatively the only skill required. In an ideal world it would be good if you could go round as fast as you can, maybe 4 stop and come the last few laps be within a few seconds of those cruising around on say 2 stoppers.
    Mostly impossible to make tryes like that but it would be nice if there were several ways to win a race. At the moment you seem to have a choice of conservation, or more conservation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Autosport
    McLaren believes the key to getting itself back to the front in Formula 1 is getting on top of the 2012 tyres.

    After a disappointing Bahrain Grand Prix, where Lewis Hamilton and Jenson Button struggled to match the pace of Red Bull and Lotus, team boss Martin Whitmarsh thinks that understanding the characteristics of this year's rubber is now vital.

    When asked by AUTOSPORT if the most important factor over the course of the season will be exploiting the tyres rather than delivering improvements to its car, Whitmarsh said: "In my view yes, because our downforce hasn't evaporated and disappeared.

    "The inherent performance of the car is there, you could see it in qualifying. So then when you stand back, it has to be how we exploit those tyres. And here we were killing the rear tyres, and that made it very difficult for the drivers.

    "Our drivers really didn't stand a chance. I think with something like that, it's pressures, temperatures; it's how we are using those tyres. It's a bit of a concern. We have to be calm, analytical and fix it."
    Last edited by BrightLampShade; 23/04/2012 at 01:11 PM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    7,361
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    852

    Default

    Thats the wonderful thing about Pirelli's, it's a double edged sword. Faster the car the quicker the tyres degrade "in retrospect", having the fastest car doesn't make or break a season now.

    Driver input and having the car to work around the tyres for the whole season is the game changer here. Yeah maybe Mercedes and McLaren have the fastest car in qualifying but if they cant do that over a course of a race, whose fault is that?

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    4,342
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    8

    Default

    I am not convinced how much tyre management is being that relevant really. I think the real crucial factors is how the car uses it's tyres rather than how the driver can look after them. The tyres have a very small operating window and it has been shown that when teams have been able to set their cars up to operate the tyres in that windows then they have been fast, and when teams have not quite been able to then they have struggled.

    So really I do not think it is driver tyres management which is having the impact but rather how the teams can utilise the tyres and surely that is no difference in utilising exhaust gases or improving aerodynamics. If a car has hardly any downforce then I suppose their driver can not push as hard as he wants either, or if a car has an unstable rear then a driver will not be able to push as hard as they can either. This is F1 not Mario Karts.
    Last edited by Masanari; 23/04/2012 at 01:49 PM.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ashby de la Zouch LE67
    Age
    68
    Posts
    1,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    817

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverArrow View Post
    Thats the wonderful thing about Pirelli's, it's a double edged sword. Faster the car the quicker the tyres degrade "in retrospect", having the fastest car doesn't make or break a season now.

    Driver input and having the car to work around the tyres for the whole season is the game changer here. Yeah maybe Mercedes and McLaren have the fastest car in qualifying but if they cant do that over a course of a race, whose fault is that?
    But its not racing is it.

    Its boring, and frustrating, I'm losing interest.

    Just look at Raikkonen's race, ruined, he had to slow down to get to the finish.




  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    7,361
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    852

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ErnieBecclestone View Post
    But its not racing is it.

    Its boring, and frustrating, I'm losing interest.

    Just look at Raikkonen's race, ruined, he had to slow down to get to the finish.



    Well the teams did complain last year but they got to grips with them in the end, so I feel the teams are to blame if they cannot design a car that can be fast, reliable but yet delicate with their tyres.

    I dont think Kimi's race was ruined it was saved in my opinion thanks to the pirelli's. He started 11th with a fresh set of options to use unlike most in front of him. If this was on Bridgestones Seb would of most likely flown off into the distance from the word go with a gap of 20+ seconds. Lewis' pitstop blunders would of still happend and it would of taken the Lotus' longer to get past Webber, building a bigger gap for Seb while in clean air.

    Kimi in my opinion would of never got on the podium if he was on Bridestones, but thanks to the advantage of sitting 11th he was able to close the gap to Seb giving us a tense fight for 1st and he almost pulled it off.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    10,193
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    294153

    Default

    Kimi's race yesterday is the perfect argument of the tyres NOT restricting a driver's ability to race. He was fast and aggressive all race, just not in the reckless, wheelspinning way that some others might be who complain about the fragility of the car. You don't have to drive slowly to preserve tyres, locking wheels under braking and spinning the rears under traction both damage the tyres and lose lap time.

  10. #10
    Newbie
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Up t North
    Posts
    21
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SilverArrow View Post
    Well the teams did complain last year but they got to grips with them in the end, so I feel the teams are to blame if they cannot design a car that can be fast, reliable but yet delicate with their tyres.

    I dont think Kimi's race was ruined it was saved in my opinion thanks to the pirelli's. He started 11th with a fresh set of options to use unlike most in front of him. If this was on Bridgestones Seb would of most likely flown off into the distance from the word go with a gap of 20+ seconds. Lewis' pitstop blunders would of still happend and it would of taken the Lotus' longer to get past Webber, building a bigger gap for Seb while in clean air.

    Kimi in my opinion would of never got on the podium if he was on Bridestones, but thanks to the advantage of sitting 11th he was able to close the gap to Seb giving us a tense fight for 1st and he almost pulled it off.
    But this is it for me, why should Kimi have an advantage for starting 11th? This is the only thing that annoys me, other than that i like the tyre aspect, but it is getting a bit close to being the only thing that matters as previously said.


  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    122
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    6

    Default

    I think it's interesting that so many people are talking about the tyres issue rather than other factors affecting car performance and pace. The Pirelli's seem to be overachieving their purpose. It's not that the idea is wrong, more that the effect is too dramatic.

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ashby de la Zouch LE67
    Age
    68
    Posts
    1,499
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    817

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavlaar View Post
    But this is it for me, why should Kimi have an advantage for starting 11th? This is the only thing that annoys me, other than that i like the tyre aspect, but it is getting a bit close to being the only thing that matters as previously said.
    It's all a bit too contrived for my liking.

    I prefer the opposite lock, four wheel slide, grippy tyres, wheeelspin, flat out kart style of driving, not poncing about with tyre management being the primary factor.

    Bring back the Goodyear's

  13. #13
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    3,095
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    41283

    Default

    Do you want to go back to the 2010 ways and having the most boring races in the history of the world? The only good race was Canada..Where tyre deg was high. I cant think of another good 2010 race.
    This year has had some of the best races, hell, even Bahrain was good.. And that's impossible. The tyres are great.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    122
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    6

    Default

    We've had some relatively boring race era's in the past, but we've also had some very exciting years over the past decade. The Pirelli's have certainly spiced things up recently along with DRS and KERS but that's covering up the advances in aerodynamic design which have made overtaking so difficult. As mentioned by others, it's the rules governing tyre use which could be changed for the better.

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Pull off the A140 at Mendlesham, stop at the house on the left and ask for Steve. He'll guide you.
    Posts
    4,661
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    204912

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by fred! View Post
    do you want to go back to the 2010 ways and having the most boring races in the history of the world? The only good race was canada..where tyre deg was high. I cant think of another good 2010 race.
    This year has had some of the best races, hell, even bahrain was good.. And that's impossible. The tyres are great.
    this.

  16. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    7,542
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    2655279

    Default

    Racing is not racing anymore, it is a confusion of sorts. There is a fine line between entertainment, and an utter mess. Drivers who have raw pace cannot show it, Ham/Raikk/Schumacher/Alonso..

  17. #17
    Moderator
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    5,487
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    118967

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by EternalMSC View Post
    Racing is not racing anymore, it is a confusion of sorts. There is a fine line between entertainment, and an utter mess. Drivers who have raw pace cannot show it, Ham/Raikk/Schumacher/Alonso..
    Except they all do, bar schumacher. Raikkonen and Alonso have trashed their teammates on race pace, while Lewis has a much harder teammate and has still edged it. Schumacher simply isn't one of the guys with the raw pace.

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    793
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    4

    Default

    Im with Schumacher on this; Pirelli are have a bit of a laugh really. I never want to see the best drivers in the world pushing at 50% of their ability trying to conserve tyres, I want to see 100% every lap.

    Just look at the last race, Jenson who is known for being the best at looking after his tyres did 8 LAPS in his first stint, thats just ridiculous from Pirelli. I hope a few more drivers come forward about the tyres. If Paul Hembrey wants to be stubborn by dismissing the views of the drivers then bring in another tyre manufacturer alongside Pirelli and lets see who the teams sign a contract with.

    We have enough in this sport to spice things up with the new regulations, DRS, KERS.

  19. #19
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    341
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    4

    Default

    It wasn't Schumacher's tyres that meant he finished in the lower points, it was his grid position. I think this is just a moan from a Schumacher irrated at Rosberg's success, compared to his disappointments.

    Like others have said, I believe the racing to be fantastic since Pirelli joined the sport. And I don't think tyre wear is anywhere near being the only factor when achieving success.

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    7,542
    Post Thanks / Like
    Rep Power
    2655279

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TheModestMatt View Post
    Im with Schumacher on this; Pirelli are have a bit of a laugh really. I never want to see the best drivers in the world pushing at 50% of their ability trying to conserve tyres, I want to see 100% every lap.

    Just look at the last race, Jenson who is known for being the best at looking after his tyres did 8 LAPS in his first stint, thats just ridiculous from Pirelli. I hope a few more drivers come forward about the tyres. If Paul Hembrey wants to be stubborn by dismissing the views of the drivers then bring in another tyre manufacturer alongside Pirelli and lets see who the teams sign a contract with.

    We have enough in this sport to spice things up with the new regulations, DRS, KERS.
    It's ridiculous ain't it, this is meant to be the pinnacle of motorsport, everything at 100%.. not a child's game. I hope something is changed this season.


Page 1 of 18 1 2 3 11 ... Last

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts