Responsible Gambling: Help & Guidance

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by TopClass, Mar 12, 2017.

  1. ChelseaCOE2012

    ChelseaCOE2012 Well-Known Member

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  2. Cyclonic

    Cyclonic Well Hung Member

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    Have a mate who about a year or so ago won $15k in the slots, he's given it all back. They're about the ugliest form of betting there is. At least with horses, cards, sports etc, we get the chance to pit a reasoned opinion against the odds, but with slots, it's all noise and flashing colours. It's mindless gambling.

    P.S. Sorry to hear about your dad Bob. Cancer spreads it wings far and wide, my wife's mum is receiving palliative care for the same condition and my father went in 05 from it. The eulogy thing for the old man was awful. As the eldest child, it fell to me. I sat for hours with pen and paper, but when the moment came, I found myself standing there with written material that didn't really do justice to him. So I just shoved the papers into a pocket and winged it. I'm so glad I did, for quite to my surprise, an outpouring of emotion allowed the old fella the send off he deserved. I haven't for a day regretted it. Glad to hear about the bub, rejoice my friend. :)
     
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  3. Onlyfoolsandhorses

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    Great to see so many responses on this thread and in some ways you learn more about folks on here than you do on the daily thread. I would never have thought BB was in his 30's (thought you were much wiser than that :)) and the life people have to live outside this forum bubble. It brings some reality home that we can all brag about the great vets we've had and the impact it can have on us but above and beyond it all is that family and life should always be the priority over anything that goes on here.
    Thanks to all for sharing here as I think this thread alone is a reality check we all need from time to time that it's meant to be a fun pastime and let's always keep that in perspective.
     
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  4. SimonJ

    SimonJ Active Member

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    How true was this over the last 4 days!!!
    I need to rediscover the betting patterns that got me a good return last season; that will mean less multiples and more sensible priced singles where I would always play the value angle; there I've said it, now I need to stick to it ( no pun intended ).
     
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  5. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    The way I look at multiples is to gauge whether I would stake a certain amount as a single bet on any one of the selections. Eg if I had 4 selections and one was odds on, would I stake all the potential winnings from the other 3 on the odds on shot? The answer would almost certainly be NO. So why include it. I would apply that thinking to all the selections. Therefore I only believe in single bets, giving me the opportunity to decide on the stake (if any) on the next one. A multiple bet is an unnecessary commitment. Actually, I don't bet; but if I did ..............
     
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  6. QuarterMoonII

    QuarterMoonII Economist

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    Bob, like everyone else I am sorry to hear about your personal travails; and wish you and yours the best with the new member of your fledgling viticulture dynasty.

    Your posting does appear to be a contradiction, as you appear to be the opposite of me: you follow the NH scene and give the Flat a miss whilst I do the reverse. Either way around, we are clearly both in charge/control of our betting habits. I can watch any race meeting without having a bet (have gone to the races plenty of times and not had a bet) and could stop betting tomorrow if I wanted. I have always written down all my bets so I know what I have won/lost over the year.

    I have to say that I do actually find myself in agreement with Ron to some extent about the role of willpower in addiction (not just gambling). Most of the people that I know who smoke started as teenagers because they would not say ‘no’ and became addicts; whereas, I just said ‘no’ and never started. Addicts, whether gambling, smoking or any other vice find it very difficult to give up but those trying to help them kick their habit have to find the right motivation for somebody who is, frankly, weak willed.

    When I used to work for a bookie, 20-30 years ago, I was regularly in contact with gambling addicts – they were in the office every day no matter how poor the racing (pre-internet, pre-satellite TV coverage); and most had nothing better to do with their day, perhaps because their gambling led to their financial (and possibly moral) impoverishment. I did know one guy who worked away for three months at a time in the Saudi oilfields and would spend his time back in Blighty between the pub and the bookies, buying half the town a beer in one and throwing hundreds at the next dog race in the other; presumably purely for entertainment, excitement and ego in both cases.

    I had a few bets at Cheltenham purely for an interest and spent the four days with some friends in the pub watching the races while we had a £5-a-head “ITV 7” competition for fun – which I won on Friday with Sizing John, a second and two thirds paying for the beer! Most of us had had a few bets but nothing like £400k at 1/4.

    I can only see problem gambling getting worse as it is heavily marketed (with little regulation or morality) and easily accessible in the era of digital slavery, as I do see the youth of today as more gullible because they have never lived in a world without all-consuming technology. It is almost an addiction that has become more easily acquired (and socially acceptable) than tobacco and drugs.

    My observations in the local bookies from Cheltenham week would suggest to me that it is probably time that dubious ‘free bet’ offers (that simply encourage the easily led) were reined in. The ‘colleague’ in one well-known high street firm seemed quite perturbed when I declined his offer of some free credit on one of their gaming machines if I signed up to one of their accounts/marketing schemes. Virtually every time I went on Oddschecker to check betting patterns and best prices, I would get pop-up adverts offering ridiculously good odds about short-priced favourites where the returns were not paid out in cash but ‘free bets’. Surely this is just fostering addiction, whilst paying lip-service by funding the GambleAware organisation.

    Perhaps it is time that, even in our supposedly free market society, the business of gambling ceased to be treated entirely under the old premise that wagering is a gentlemen’s agreement. Whether we like it or not the youth of today (the so-called Millennials) are coach potatoes, heading inexorably down the path of technological dependence, with little or no education in managing their personal finances; so they will find themselves burdened with personal debt very early in life.
     
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  7. Sir Percy

    Sir Percy Member

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    Betfair (Sportsbook) is quite good as it tells you what your net deposits are so you can easily see how much you've won/lost with them.

    Perhaps other bookies should offer a similar feature so people can track more easily?
    I know you can view your bet history but it's not as easy to establish exactly how much is going in and out, with betfair it shows you there plain as day.
     
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  8. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    A simple spreadsheet would suffice
     
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  9. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    Every gambler would be well advised to keep proper records, for any number of reasons.

    Unfortunately, for the addict there's no time for that; not when they're going in the traps at Monmore.
     
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  10. Steveo77

    Steveo77 Well-Known Member

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    90% of my gambling is limited to the TV racing (so mostly every Saturday)
    for this I keep vague records.

    for the festivals (flat and NH) I keep detailed records.
    just been checking after Cheltenham (which was my 4th worst ever this year!) but since I began keeping records, up until the start of Cheltenham this year I had pretty much broken even which surprised me. I thought that I would be definitely down. Hey ho - after last week I am!
    Anyway I do it more for interest than anything else and so have bets going for all 28 festival races.

    some years I am up, some I am down. deep down I know I am never going to make a profit long term but for me breaking even means I have had a fun time watching the festival pretty much for free.

    same with the summer flat festivals, which after Cheltenham I probably enjoy the most.
    this is always a great time of year with the NH horses at their peak at Cheltenham and Aintree yet the summer flat is just days away...

    most important thing to remember - DONT BET MORE THAN YOU CAN AFFORD!
     
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    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
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  11. Steveo77

    Steveo77 Well-Known Member

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    spot on there - for the Gold Cup last week there were 2 horses I thought could win it (Djakadam & Sizing John)
    I bet on both to win but the greatest profit was on Djakadam. I should have had the same stake but the most money on Sizing John.
    Always easy in hindsight.....one of these years I will be disciplined enough to get it right!
     
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  12. Steveo77

    Steveo77 Well-Known Member

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    I agree multiple bets can be very costly as they very rarely (in my experience) come in.
    a few years ago at Cheltenham I did have one of my most successful bets though when I had a winning lucky 15 bet (included Zarakandar and Bobs Worth I think)
    I suddenly though this is easy! and started having lots of lucky 15 bets which all of course lost!!

    I now limit those to 1 lucky 15 bet each Cheltenham festival.
     
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  13. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    A long time ago, with the aid of Timeform Horses to Follow and their weekly Black Book, I had a fiver on a 4 horse accumulator. The first one won at 8/1 the other 3 were favs and the last one had to survive a photo and stewards enquiry. Returned £500. I tried it again and failed and decided not to give it all back. I stopped betting altogether shortly after; but I had a stable tip for a beautifully bred newcomer that was "going to win and would never be odds against again". It was odds on and I lost £100 on that - and it never won a race subsequently. The only time I bet is a budgeted stake when I go to the races and that is rare. Didn't have a bet at Cheltenham and won't be having one on the Grand National. But I enjoy just as much, if not more, trying to pick winners and watching them on TV where possible. I love going to race meetings where the best horses run but sadly I don't get the time these days
     
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  14. gazboy

    gazboy Well-Known Member

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    Good evening gents, im an addict. Ive lost 1 marriage, several jobs,careers whatever. I now have THE most understanding partner who gives me a budget (pocket money) each week. I now gamble within my means and the winnings/returns i save on a monthly basis and cash in. I dont win what I used to but we are together twice as long as my marriage lasted. I only bet cash, and in shop. Hand over cash collect cash.
     
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  15. DreverSpur

    DreverSpur Well-Known Member

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    Really great thread and good to share guys.

    I sometimes wonder, what defines an addict? Although I don't gamble everyday and very, very rarely during flat season I would say I am an addict. When the NH season arrives I absorb as much information, reading articles and checking results, almost cutting myself off from the loved ones around me.

    A little over 5 years ago I won £14k in the space of 6 days - I gave it back and much more within a month. That's what makes me an addict, that lack of self control or restraint and no doubt it could happen again - although I'm determined not to allow it to. My inability at that time to walk away with a large amount of money in my pocket and just say "Enough" disgusts me but I'm done with torturing myself about it, it happened and I have dealt with it,

    I would say greed and the need to be 'right' about an outcome are the driving forces of my own addiction.
     
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  16. Cyclonic

    Cyclonic Well Hung Member

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    Cutting stuff mate. The balls and all assessment of what drives you on, has hopefully given you the tools needed to stick a knife in it. <applause>
     
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    Last edited: Mar 24, 2017 at 9:57 AM
  17. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    I had my "last hurrah" with the Cheltenham festival and have now self-excluded infinitely from my one and only online betting account. I didn't enjoy the betting at all, in fact it spoilt the festival for me, but I forced myself to keep betting as I knew it was exactly the therapy I needed. I lost somewhere in the region of €1500 (which was my planned pot, money I could afford to lose). I have now completely lost any desire to bet on a horse race. I can't really remember what I bet on to be honest - had a big win bet on Native River and also on Petit Mouchoir, and a small win bet on Defi Du Seuil. I backed Greatrex twice (bumper horse and the one which fell in the Albert Bartlett). The rest just seems a blur.

    I really like the comment from Gaz about only betting cash - online betting where you don't physically have to hand over money just makes it so easy to lose control.

    I'll keep popping on the forum from time to time, may or may not watch the Grand National, Guineas, Oaks, Derby etc. We'll see. But I won't be spending any more time studying form, looking at racecards trying to pick a winner. Last Saturday afternoon I took my son shopping for some new shoes - a much more enjoyable way to become a few Euros worse off than backing a loser in the Midlands National <ok>
     
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  18. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    Priorities sorted.
     
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  19. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    So much depends on what you like most, horse racing or betting. If it's horse racing then it is at least as enjoyable to try to pick a winner and watch without betting. You will soon find that you mostly limit your attention to only top quality races and horses that you have become attached to or have some other (non financial) interest in. You can also have an outing to a track with a fixed betting budget that you treat as part of the budgeted expense of the outing. Have a look at the horses in the pre-parade and parade and see which ones you like the look of. Experience the atmosphere at the winners' enclosure. It all adds to the enjoyment as opposed to the enjoyment being governed by whether you win or lose your hard earned. With luck you may make enough profit to cover the expenses or even to treat the family out or buy something for the wife/kids. Without luck you have had an enjoyable outing with the family. Make it an enjoyable past-time - not an addiction. Remember, there are so many reasons why your horse may not win and accept them; that should stop you getting heavily involved and chasing losses.
     
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  20. QuarterMoonII

    QuarterMoonII Economist

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    Hindsight is a wonderful thing and everyone can have it. Obviously this thread has a limited audience but it is interesting to read how some of us have dealt with the realisation that their addiction is gambling. Sorry to read that the likes of gazboy have paid what I would consider a very high price to confront their addiction.

    Ultimately, I think that addiction is something to which we are all susceptible although gambling is not necessarily the medium to which we become addicted. Myself, I think I could make a case for being addicted to real ale, as the only time when I have not had a pint for more than a fortnight in the last thirty years I was in hospital in a coma; but I have never tried to go without so it might not be an addiction.

    For quite a long time, I have really only gone to the races for two reasons: the lesser reason is when going with friends on some sort of organised visit (a long wait until this year’s only current planned one in November) and the greater reason is when I take the camera (photography a hobby since I was a teenager) to mostly the top meetings looking for that photograph of one of my favourite horses of that time.

    Perhaps I had the good fortune to start in the bookmaking business and quickly realise that most punters are on a hiding to nothing (a luxury not afforded to many). I virtually never do multiple bets (except small accas on football matches) and I bet primarily just because I like to be right – if I finish the year having made a profit then that year I knew more about it than the old enemy. My staking has scarcely changed in the last twenty years so my betting is inflation-proof and easily estimated in advance. As has been said, only bet what you can afford to lose. Having no dependents, I theoretically have plenty of disposable income but do not gamble with it.
     
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