Match Day Thread Palace vs United

****ing Ole out, what kind of manager tells his players to play at walking pace, hit passes to the opposition, lose/give away possession every few touches and strole around watching the game instead of finding space and using it.
Poor players deserve better

 

It's what he's not telling them that's causing that though mate.

 

I haven’t even started attacking the manager and you’re already ahead defending him.

 

What, like how to play football?
Surely if you know that and i know that then players on thousands of pounds per week should have some clue?

 

Let’s get eleven new players then.

 

I've posted about this on the Chelsea match thread. A manager has to provide some identity and tactical approach to our football. If it was simply about the players then no club would need a manager.

In short, we have a reasonable defence, we have a decent midfield, we have a decent attack. In their own right they are technically good enough. But it takes a manager to link that together. Our fault lies in how we link/transition from defence to midfield to the attack. That is where the manager earns his money.

Just an example of this was in the final 10 mins of the game. I expected us to be laying siege to their goal. We spent all of it either passing it around in our own half, barely able to pass the half-way line or giving away possession because the defence couldn't link up with the midfield, and then Palace were attacking our goal. That was damning.

 

Thought you didn't want to buy players?

Are you seriously taking the stance that players like Maguire and Matic are told to play **** passes, does the manager tell Greenwood (talented player) to take on 4 players in the area and attempt a shot 4 or 5 times per game (could probably do it against 2), does he tell players to take 5 or 6 touches on the ball every time he has it.

Have you ever listened to what the manager says after games because if you did you might realise he doesn't think they are doing as asked so who is deciding what they do?

 

A manager can only set a team up in a rough formation because other teams don't do exactly what you expect/would like them to do.
from there he can make in game changes if he see's a weakness in the opposition or a threat to a player who is getting out-played/over run.
A football game is fluid, if it wasn't we could all predict every game before the kickoff.

Watch City, they are mesmerising once you realise how they play but you need hard working, very intelligent players to carry it off. The whole game is based on triangles of players, 3 players involved in every attacking or possession move and 3 players involved in every press to win the ball back but it's not as easy as that.
Every triangle has at least one player involved in another triangle so that out ball can be moved on, when one triangle moves the ball on the two "spare" players immediately move to join another triangle (this is where the intelligence and hard work comes in. Once you have seen it it's hard to ignore and i often find myself watching the movement of the players in their games more than the actual match/ball.

 

Maybe you should share all that with Ole mate

I know one thing is for sure, if Pep was managing this squad they'd be playing a heck of a lot better. And that in itself sums up where the problem lies.

 

My point was City don't play to some magical set system, they utilise a tactic that depends on the intelligence of the players and their willingness to work.

I will point to the second best team in the league for the last few years too, Liverpool. They don't have any magic system to win games, their biggest tactic is a long ball out to the wide men (mostly the full backs) and hope the front 3 are good enough to score when the ball is crossed in, this of course all depends on the midfield/defence gaining the ball and making that pass. A valid tactic when the strikers are on **** hot form but not so good when not.

The best manager ever involved in the game didn't have a set way of playing (yes he set the team up 4 4 2 more or less, no not Mike England ) but once on the pitch he relied on the intelligence of the players to move the ball to their best advantage.
Guess who that was

 

I noticed that the Spurs fan fully approved your rant


That performance tonight was absolutely abject. Started badly and never recovered. Basic passes were not completed, the front three were static, no variation in the play. If the players do not take responsibility for that **** then there is no hope. They got nothing and that’s all they deserved

 

Imagine if a Manchester United team under Sir Alex plays this badly match in, match out...

Diego, you’re going to insane lengths to still place the blame squarely on the players. Your augment is fascinating to say the least.

No need to beat the dead horse. We have effectively become a joke team.

 

That's all called being coached. Having a game plan.

Are you (as you seem to be) suggesting the players go out on the pitch and decide all this themselves, as if the actual manager is irrelevant to their performance?

Like Alex Ferguson won 13 league titles by picking a team, sending them on the pitch and essentially saying, go for it?

The question is, how can you not question the manager in these circumstances? Even if it's just for a clear lack of inspiration.

It's a bizarre way of thinking = when we're good praise the manager/when we're **** blame the players. The manager has to take some of the responsibility, as well as credit when it's due.

Bottom line is, he's had a real go and is now being found wanting, that's pretty much the long and short of it.

As I've said about a million times, the football club should be in the process of recruiting his replacement right now, not just reacting when it's too late.
That may seem harsh on Ole but he's landed a job he should never really have had full time, he was supposed to be interim and the club ****ed that one up.

As usual.

 

Thst is exactly what we haven’t done here. When we won the players either got all the praise as they are “good anyway” or the opposition was ****. Nothing to do with the manager. When we lost or drew it was the manager being **** as he didn’t coach the players. Yesterday was a match which we should have won. Nothing to do with tactics or coaching when the players couldn’t put 3 yard passes together.

 

I can't really recall ever saying it was all down to the players when we've had a decent performance.

Buck stops with the manager, always. That's how it works, that's why it's the managers who get sacked, not players.

 

Of course I didn’t mean you specifically. I’ve said before the players are not as good as some here think. We desperately need a DOF to stop this managerial Merry go round. A new manager will be no better than the previous 4.

 

Shakes head!

Every single message that you post still shows your bias, even when you try. Same goes for Diego and Glazer.

Remove your emotions and you can start seeing the situation for what it is through results over the past three years. We have stagnated, flat and our main rivals love our manager. Go figure!

As for players not being as good as people think... that is falsehood bs! We have seen the very same players blow teams out of the water. Their problem is lack of consistency and sadly, apathy. Look at the lineup yesterday and ask how many PL teams have the same depth bar City. Those are solid players that we have invested heavily in over the years. But they lack cohesion to operate at the highest level consistently. #manager’s responsibility!!! Heck, this team couldn’t even accommodate Lukaku yet we still think that we are not good enough.

To your last point that the next manager won’t be better than last 4... Com’on, Christian! That is a terrible statement to make which again displays a complete flawed way of objectively looking at The problem. It shows your bias simply to vindicate Ole as the right man for the job when the results prove otherwise.

I will say this though... the problem with the club is not the manager. It is squarely Woodward. His methodology for selecting managers and transfers is flawed. For as long as he remains in charge of those functions, I am not confident that there will ever be a meaningful change at the club. There will be sparse periods of success, but it won’t be maintained.

 

This is madness. To say last night is nothing to do with tactics or coaching. To even suggest that tactics don't exist in football and that Pep and Klopp don't have any. It's so crazy I'm baffled that I've wondered into the Twilight Zone.

If rival fans read this they'd laugh their tits off because I know I would if this was being said on the Livpl board about their team.

I think some are clutching at extreme straws here that they will claim night is day just to argue the point.

Btw when we've performed well, I can pull up every thread where both players and manager were praised.

 

That's why we have become a joke. Way too emotional and less objective.

 

So I have the transcript for the training session just before the Palace game -

Ole - Listen boys, we need to be really poor tonight.

Harry - Got it gaffer, should I act like I can't string a single three yard pass together?

Ole - Excellent H - anyone else?

Matic - Boss, could I **** about all over the pitch doing not very much at all?

Ole - Hey big M, you read my mind, top man as always. The rest of you listen up - the last thing we want is to score goals and challenge for the PL title, I would hope that has sunk in by now after all the sessions we've worked hard on at Carrington.....

Murmurs, ....................

Ole - Don't start ****ing moaning now, we all started the season saying we deliberately weren't going to play well just to annoy the fan base - we are all in this together. And another thing, I don't know if you know but there is so much good stuff on Netflix these days and the last thing I need is for you lot to play well and get us involved in those European competitions, that really ****s up my binge watching of Broadchurch and stuff - so remember - mis-placed passes, just like we practiced all week, no penetration on the wings and - don't sit there smirking strikers - I want you lot deliberately missing chances and mis-firing - have you all got that??? So to recap, I set you up to play like tossers one night and world beaters the next - on purpose, of course.

That Ole, hey it's all his fault - certainly not the players, they couldn't perhaps be at fault for say, being ****ing idle, for thinking Palace was a simple game and they could take their foot off the pedal..........................