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Off Topic The Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Queens Park Rangers' started by Stroller, Jun 25, 2015.

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Should the UK remain a part of the EU or leave?

Poll closed Jun 24, 2016.
  1. Stay in

    56 vote(s)
    47.9%
  2. Get out

    61 vote(s)
    52.1%
  1. ELLERS

    ELLERS Well-Known Member

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    Kettle...black
     
    #64081
  2. ELLERS

    ELLERS Well-Known Member

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    I know that, you have told me before.
     
    #64082
  3. surreyhoop

    surreyhoop Well-Known Member

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    He doesn't have to explain Ellers. There are many articles you can look up yourself that are on this topic. On the face of it ID is not a bad idea, but dig deeper and is it necessary? No is the fast answer as voter fraud not an issue. Not now or for past 100+ years. Unless of course you have evidence that lets say Atlee ousted Churchill in 1945 in nefarious circumstaces. Was he aided by some dodgy votes for example? Perhaps Clement Attlee outdid him in 1945 and introduced the NHS under Labour as a cruel joke. Do you support the NHS Ellers or was that a historical Labour blunder in your eyes?
     
    #64083
  4. surreyhoop

    surreyhoop Well-Known Member

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    And before you say it...yes I know Churchill won again in the 50's! My point being voting ID not necessary. I think our electorate can decide and a broadchurch with no restrictions is surely good. We are not a country of disenfranchisement.
     
    #64084
  5. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    Who doesn't have some form of id these days
     
    #64085
    Goldhawk-Road likes this.
  6. Steelmonkey

    Steelmonkey Well-Known Member

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    Who checks the ID of postal voters?
     
    #64086
  7. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    you can on your downtime
     
    #64087
  8. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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  9. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    please log in to view this image
     
    #64089
  10. Steelmonkey

    Steelmonkey Well-Known Member

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    What if they're dead, or in Peru? Do I get a free flight to check the ones in Peru?
     
    #64090
    kiwiqpr likes this.

  11. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    please log in to view this image
     
    #64091
  12. kiwiqpr

    kiwiqpr Barnsie Mod

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    id is bad
    please log in to view this image
     
    #64092
    KentGaz, ELLERS and Goldhawk-Road like this.
  13. Quite Possibly Raving

    Quite Possibly Raving Well-Known Member

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    #64093
    daverangers likes this.
  14. Frome-Ranger

    Frome-Ranger Well-Known Member

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    Boris not fan or is he?
     

    Attached Files:

    #64094
    kiwiqpr likes this.
  15. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    I read an edited version and it is a really interesting read, particularly as regards the struggle between the hardliners and moderates in the Labour Party, and the changes that are taking place in our society which makes the old left views of the unions etc worthless.

    But the elephant in the room is Brexit, not mentioned, and nor was the fact that Labour, Corbyn, Starmer and Blair himself were all prepared to ignore a democratic vote and demand a second referendum. They all misjudged the mood of the country, so perhaps it's not that surprising that Blair decided to overlook it in his article.
     
    #64095
    daverangers, ELLERS and rangercol like this.
  16. Quite Possibly Raving

    Quite Possibly Raving Well-Known Member

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    Good point. Perhaps deliberately making the point that it's also how Labour should now approach Brexit? Don't laud it's (perceived) benefits [disingenuous, people will see through that] and don't moan about it [broken record, not a proven vote winner]. Leave it in the past and plan for a 2024 election that won't be about Brexit, and get in a position to answer the 'real questions' which he poses on technological change, culture clashes and the new role of the state.

    Edit - no idea why this is in strikethrough and no idea how to change it <doh>
     
    #64096
  17. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I think Starmer and Blair just don't want to go there. We're out of the EU - forget we were ever in it (!) and move on. However, if Labour ever get into power, the hard left would press for another referendum and/or free movement of people from and to the EU
     
    #64097
  18. Quite Possibly Raving

    Quite Possibly Raving Well-Known Member

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    If you'll forgive the pedantry, as your broad point is correct, I think a lot of the hard left were actually quite pro Brexit. Comrade Corbyn perhaps a case in point. But yes, I think a lot of the soft left would want Starmer to keep on being vocal about it - and I think that's a good example of the challenge underpinning Blair's article. This is a proper rebuild job, not a quick fix like a change of leader.
     
    #64098
  19. Goldhawk-Road

    Goldhawk-Road Well-Known Member

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    A lot of traditional Labour voters supported Brexit certainly, and Corbyn was conflicted. Momentum was neutral originally but then went on to support Labour's second referendum call. Yes, I guess you could say the call to rejoin the EU could come from anywhere in the Labour movement.

    A rebuild job certainly. How easy is it, though, to rebuild a party that is effectively made up of two parties anyway? Not...
     
    #64099
  20. Quite Possibly Raving

    Quite Possibly Raving Well-Known Member

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    Yep. It's a bloody big job. Easy for Blair to put it on paper. Quite another thing to do.
     
    #64100
    rangercol likes this.

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