To get promoted next season

this is what gets me every time, after that first half i was stupid/mental/senile enough to hope they would continue it in the second half but as you rightly say, it has been a wee bit of a 'theme' through the season, as has the amount of failed and misplaced passes.

apparently LJ has a style he prefers to play but did not have the players needed...this summer needs to have a constructive, early, transfer window to get those players in (i presume the new regime has already identified targets) get them 'bedded in' and get a good pre-season out of them, hopefully these more robust player that LJ seeks are found as well.

 

Exactly. It's not hard to see what we need. Most of board have suggested players. They just need to approach them. If they haven't already and get deals done. Hopefully we'll see some new faces from June onwards given players and agents holidays.

 

The only harm in giving LJ until Xmas is that we may lose too much ground in the promo stakes, but I don’t think that will happen, LJ is not that bad a coach. And if we do need to bring in a new man, so what? The club throughout is adopting the high pressing game so LJ replacement will be a coach who plays that way. The players that our present coach will be bringing in will also be suited to that system. So changing the coach equals hardly a ripple. The only downside is that some of the players the new man inherits may not be the individuals he prefers, but as long as they can slot into the system every should be ok.

 

That's the beauty of the new system. While I'm against the knee-jerk reaction of sacking Johnson at this stage, getting rid of him won't mean a big change of direction like sacking managers has done in the past.

 

If changing the coach equals hardly a ripple,why change?

 

The idea is that a change won't necessitate a wholesale change of approach or players not fitting the new man's systems, like when Allardyce came in and half of Advocaat's signings were no longer wanted.

 

Yes,but they were short term fixes mate.....more on motivation than anything else.....which I'm not knocking btw,as a short term strategy.
The hypothesis being presented was that if you have a group of players playing in a certain way,it doesn't really matter who is coaching them,if they can do it well.
So,to take it on,would the Man U side of the 90's.....Beckham,Nevilles,Butt,Scholes,Giggs have been the same if someone other than SAF was manager?

 

Arguably not. But the model is intended to mirror the approach taken by Ajax, Barcelona etc whereby coaches are appointed on the basis of their suitability to fit into the club's identity, rather than the manager moulding the identity of the club. If a coach isn't working out, he's replaced with someone else who also fits the model. As Man Utd demonstrates, the loss of a figure like Fergie has resulted in a big change in fortunes.

 

Shankly,Fergie,Wenger established the identity though marra......they didn't inherit it from someone else. A successful club establishes its' identity,recruits players accordingly and the appoints a coach to manage it.
Our problem is we need to establish the identity in the first place.

 

Agree with that and i think that KLD is doing it the smart way. Establish the identity throughout the club from above so that if a manager/head coach leaves then the identity doesn't leave with them which has happened with each of the managers you've mentioned.

 

Exactly. That's what the background appointments are intended to do. We haven't established a clear identity in the old fashioned way. Rinus Michels established Ajax's and his pupil Johan Cruyff established Barcelona's (although Vic Buckingham put in a lot of the groundwork at both clubs). We've lurched about too much from different types of manager, so they'll have to impose one.

 

Spot on.

 

Spot on. Lurching from one manager to another merely emphasises the lack of identity and structure. Appointing,as we have in the past, a manager to merely try to engineer survival.....or,in the converse,..to merely engineer promotion,is flawed thinking which will ultimately end in disaster.
We need to establish a culture which applies throughout the club from top to bottom.....and that time is now!

 

John Barnes tells some brilliant stories about what it was like to join Liverpool. He tells how they watched him for a year before signing you and by then they felt they knew everything about him. They knew he would fit. And of course their boot room kept producing the next manager so it was very consistent. One of my favourite stories from how Liverpool did it was when Molby signed he made his debut and apparently was looking nervous and kept trying to get the coaches attention. Ronnie Moran asked him what was up and Molby said you havent given any instructions, to which Moran replied we signed you because you are the best in your position - just go and play how you do. I love that. In some ways this sort of model I hope we are building. We wont watch a player for a year but if we use the data it will give us a lot of info on a player before we watch them. We wont be signing on the basis of a 2 game view or an agent recommendation, but on being as confident as you ever can be that the player is what you need. You would also hope players are used to playing the style we want as a club so they can hit the ground running. The u23s and all academy teams will play the same way and the best of those should be able to roll into the squad too. Who knows, we may even be able to promote from within and the next manager is an existing coach at the club. That was the beauty of Liverpool for so long, there was very little disruption.

 

This is it! And that's why I'm not too disappointed about not being promoted. If KLD is true to his word, this is a long term thing and we will, sooner or later, be going back up in a much stronger position than ever before. We've got to put our trust in him.

 

Excellent post marra! Everything spot on!
I've banged on about this for years on here, over the road, and anyone else who'd listen to me. It's my belief that this is the way to build club success.They didn't have the data stats in those days,they relied on trusted judgement,but we should be able to combine the two,and reach the same result.
When I first went to Roker to watch the lads,Liverpool were 2nd Division......till Shankly. He set the model.....ironically for us followed,even more successfully, by one of our very own.
You're the first person I'm aware of on here who's ever believed it as I do!

 

Yep,totally agree mate.

 

Good question. A new coach may use different players in different positions, he may be a better motivator. But as long as he keeps the same playing system there will be little disruption. Or were you joking?

 

Most successful teams adopt a style from Academy to U18s to U23s through to the First team so as they come up through the ranks they know the style of play and what is expected of them at all levels . The new management team will already be working on the model and this is evident already with the trialists and U23s we have signed to date . The U23s are in the play offs tonight to gain promotion to their first division compared to gaining just 1 solitary point last season - what a transformation ! Would hope this also happens at First Team level which would be excellent but a number of astute signings will be required .

 

I agree mate. However, Johnson needs a chance to prove he is the man for the job. With some backing he could be the man to take us forward. I'm not an "itk" by any stretch, but I've been told by some that would know that certain players, ones that can't seem to get a game or LJ "doesn't fancy" or have unexpected dips in form are in fact massive bellends behind the scenes. So wipe the slate clean next season, get rid of what needs shot of if possible and see what happens. We may have players that "want to be here" and they could be canny lads, but just because they want to be here and a canny, unfortunately doesn't mean they're good enough to be.