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LJ out (or not)

Discussion in 'Sunderland' started by Prehab26, Nov 2, 2021.

?

In or out ?

  1. In

    22 vote(s)
    14.4%
  2. Out

    97 vote(s)
    63.4%
  3. Still undecided

    34 vote(s)
    22.2%
  1. Makemstine Roger

    Makemstine Roger Well-Known Member

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    he was horrible on Tuesday surely LJ saw it .He kept giving the ball away with poor passing and while watching his performance my blood was beginning to boil, and that's not normal for me, he wasn't the only one with a poor performance the substitutions were woeful in the Players picked so i agreed with Wes in his assessment which was very close to what i though
     
    #1101
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  2. Pure River Slut

    Pure River Slut Well-Known Member

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    I agree with this, though to be fair they were both fairly **** ! I was crying out for Embleton tbh who is slightly better at retaining the ball and can add to the set pieces and a bit more useful defensively. The negativity of the change he made was stark.
     
    #1102
  3. clockstander

    clockstander Well-Known Member

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    Wrong tactics then, square pegs in round holes with no plan B
     
    #1103
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  4. sheepman

    sheepman Well-Known Member

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    Sounds about right.
    As I saw it we were 1-0 up they were down to 10 men and with Winchester pushing on in midfield they were visibly tiring and sitting back
    Bringing on Evans and putting Winchester to full back pushed us back about 20 yards. Evans did his usual and sat far too deep leaving a gaping hole in our midfield which they took advantage of. For once our midfield and defense looked sound we were playing 10 men. We just needed a bit more drive and creativity up top.
    Its been done to death but the substitution was a massive contributory factor in us not winning that game
    Lot of debate about LJ's thinking and I've tried hard to understand but the more I think about it the more ridiculous it gets.
    The substitution would have been strange at any time but against 10 men on the front foot and Shrewsbury looking spent it was an absolute nonsense.
     
    #1104
  5. Makemstine Roger

    Makemstine Roger Well-Known Member

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    another good assesment
     
    #1105
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  6. FellTop

    FellTop Well-Known Member

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    I am a Johnson in man as most will know and disagree with. I have to say it is not a substitution I would have made however. I did think O'Brien was innefective and needed the hook, but we were disrupted by it. I would have put McGeady on and tried to draw some fouls and get in their half more. I doubt Johnson told them to go so deep mind but that is what happened. This said it was his substitutions against Ipswich, in my opinion, that turned a draw into a victory. From the touchline there isnt a great deal you can do influence the game drastically, barring substitutions and formations. You cant make players work harder or make better decisions, that is for them. So as a manager or coach you often live and die by your subs. This one I bet he regrets, there are others though where he has made good calls.

    I keep saying this if we were pushing at top end of championship he probably wouldnt be in charge as we would have got better. We arent though, and like our players we have someone who will push at top end of the league whilst making mistakes. Whether we can get anyone better I dont know, I havent seen anyone suggested that is clear cut.
     
    #1106
  7. The Norton Cat

    The Norton Cat Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure how that substitution demonstrates he has no Plan B. If you want to replace an underperforming player with one who'll do a similar job then Gooch for O'Brien makes sense. Similarly Winchester to right back as a result makes sense. The problem comes from the disruption that causes in midfield. If we had a fit right back, that series of changes wouldn't have been necessary.
     
    #1107
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  8. Gatesy

    Gatesy Well-Known Member

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    Great post mate :emoticon-0148-yes:
     
    #1108
  9. Gatesy

    Gatesy Well-Known Member

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    Citchley done it in 1 season with Blackpool, as did Stendal at Barnsley and Cook done it at Wigan to name a few...
     
    #1109
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  10. sheepman

    sheepman Well-Known Member

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    Agree with the Ipswich substitutions
    LJ has often made some good calls from the bench and changed the game for us.
    But they tend to be when he's forced to change things to put us on the front foot.
    I worry that the midfield we finished with on Tuesday seems to be his preferred option and it causes us massive problems.
    As soon as Evans came on he sat right back leaving a gaping hole and inviting pressure on the defense.
    He says he wants to play a pressing game but his default midfield
    sits too deep doesn't play as a unit tends to be outnumbered and is not aggressive enough.
    With the line up on Tuesday I thought this is a move in the right direction
    When we had Winchester and Neil at least they were pushing on together allowing the defense to push up and squeeze the space.
    Winchester wasn't brilliant but it was better we were on the front foot and seemed to be playing as a unit
    This for me is what made his changes hard to take. We had a team on the front foot and pressing and he went back
    to what he seems to think works. But it doesn't.
    I would love Johnson to prove us wrong and sort things out but I just have a feeling we are going round in circles
     
    #1110

  11. Bank of England 2

    Bank of England 2 Well-Known Member

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    Another thing they have to take into consideration is how many of our players will move on in the summer if we don't go up. We've potentially got our hands on a good striker and a top notch midfielder, but there will be plenty of interest in Ross Stewart and Dan Neil from sides in leagues above us. There's also a lot of loanees who may not return, and there's a few retiring or out of contract, leaving us having to bring in another draft of 8-9 players just to keep the numbers up.

    I know KLD said that it wouldn't be the end of the world if we failed to go up last season, but I doubt he'll think the same at the end of this season.
     
    #1111
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  12. Bank of England 2

    Bank of England 2 Well-Known Member

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    Whatever happens mate, we've got to keep continuity behind the scenes and a clear plan of action. The recruitment model can still remain, even if the manager doesn't.
     
    #1112
  13. rooch 3

    rooch 3 Well-Known Member

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    In a way we aren’t much different to the mags, we are asking players to play out of their skin for us when half of them know they are going to be peddled at the end of the season if we get promotion.
     
    #1113
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  14. Saf

    Saf Not606 Godfather+NOT606 Poster of the year 2023

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    <applause>

    Well said, mate. We have way to many supporters that piss their pants the second everything isn't rosy at Sunderland and its showing on here. They love supporting Sunderland when we are winning and everybody is bouncing but as soon as our backs are against the wall they turn on the latest manager, usually October/November time and around we go again.

    Johnson IN
     
    #1114
  15. Bank of England 2

    Bank of England 2 Well-Known Member

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    I take your point BB but I'm sure KLD'S 5 year plan wasn't to take 5 years to get out of this League. He'll want to see us competing in the Championship in his 3rd season.
     
    #1115
  16. Bank of England 2

    Bank of England 2 Well-Known Member

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    In previous seasons that has definitely been the case mate but this squad is full of youngsters who should be hungry and eager to build a career for themselves at a higher level. They should all be out to make names for themselves and to do that they will have to be at the top of their game.

    Rather than them be of the opinion that they will be peddled, they should want to be thinking "I have to earn the right to play 1 or 2 levels higher next season", whether that's with us or someone else.
     
    #1116
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  17. samwise_new

    samwise_new Well-Known Member

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    evans is a DM first and foremost, he is the type of player that will sit in front of the defence and usually knows when he can move upfield but he won't be doing that all the time...AoB was virtually a spectator first half bar a couple of short passes but he did start to show more in the second half and would have been a better option for a forward, the other changes made around the same time (moving players around) stifled our attack.

    i stick by my original thoughts that ipswich was just plain luck, he could have made any number of changes and i think we would somehow still have won and many a time he reverted to sticking an extra defender in to try and hold onto a one goal lead which luckily worked for a few games, although i have seen times when he has made changes and they have indeed turned the game but mainly they tend to be too late or not the right ones or he changes players around on the pitch.

    we have, by more luck than good management, stopped the rot but personally i need to see better performances and LJ being pro-active and not just reactive.
     
    #1117
  18. Nacho

    Nacho Well-Known Member

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    Interesting that O'Nien was getting slated in CM and clearly Evans would be much better.

    I'd like to see the two of them together for defensive stability or either one sitting deeper behind Neil and Embleton.
     
    #1118
  19. Teessidemackem

    Teessidemackem Well-Known Member

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  20. Ozzymac

    Ozzymac Well-Known Member

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    As an aside we're 4 points better off than we were at this time last season

    upload_2021-11-26_10-10-50.png
     
    #1120

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