Match Day Thread Liverpool v Saints Saturday 27th November, 3pm

Going to have to disagree here. We've made strides in other areas, but Armstrong has not been anything approaching a proper replacement for Ings. Beyond raw pace and perhaps health, there isn't a single area where Armstrong is close to Ings' equal.

We're an attack-minded team that is second-bottom in goals per game. It's a bit of an issue, and our strike force is a significant part of that issue.

 

****ing hell we lost?

To Liverpool?

I'm shocked beyond belief.

See you tomorrow.

 

Thank you. Thought I was going nuts!

 

No, I don’t think everyone is disagreeing with me / not sure where you got that from but no big issue either way. Don’t give a toss or not; it’s a forum. Anyway, so we’re all on same page. Let’s see.

 

We seem to be creating more chances this season than for quite some time (since under Koeman?). Ings might have had a hatful by now this season if he was still here. But he isn't.

 

Hello

 

Nothin like a cheery thought after a defeat.

 

Knew we should have played Walcott and Long!

#Ralphout

 

We're 9th in shots per match, and 18th in shots on target. There's, uh, some room for improvement in our chance conversion.

 

Not here, injured at another club, good we're not paying his wages.

 

Whereabouts do you sit on that scale magic? I only ask because you seem quite happy when Saints lose. But that's ok I quite like your posts, just a bit weird.

 

Me too.

When we lose like we did at Norwich, I hate Ralph, the team, and just about everyone at the club for a while but overall I really like him. I think he's a decent manager who may make mistakes but he's trying to shuffle a pretty ordinary pack of players who in my opinion are mostly championship quality. We play some nice entertaining stuff at times and as STHx2 that goes a long way towards why we go. The season before Puel was sacked was probably one of the most boring I've ever watched and even though Saints were relatively successful we seriously considered not renewing. Someone else might be able to organise them better but with the team we have 13th, 14th, or 15th would be a pretty good finishing position.
I also think he is a good guy with a likeable personality. I know that won't mean much to the committed "Ralph out" brigade but it does to me.

 

He'd be a great replacement if all of his effort, running and skill ended in a postive end product. Unfortunately so far it hasn't. Don't get me wrong though I do think it will. Fingers crossed of course!!!!!

 

Who - from our strongest starting line-up - is only Championship level? Sure a few of our periphery are, I admit (the likes of Elyou, Walcott, Djenepo), but otherwise all of them are better than that.

They might not be top-6 Prem level, ie; ripping defences to shreds every week a la Mane and Salah. But they are certainly good enough for mid-table Prem.

I think it’s a lazy argument to say the squad isn’t good enough. If you actually think about it we have a very decent quality team.

For me it’s on Ralph 100% if he can’t get them performing to their potential.

 

I mean...do we? Let's look at our attacking group: how many are you confident would be a consistent starter for a majority of the teams currently in the bottom ten?

Stuart Armstrong - might start for more than 50% of bottom half teams.
Che Adams - probably doesn't start for most teams, particularly those that use a lone striker.
Adam Armstrong - unlikely to start for most teams.
Nathan Redmond - very unlikely to start for most teams.
Elyounoussi - definitely doesn't start for most teams.
Armando Broja - definitely doesn't start for most teams.
Moussa Djenepo - definitely doesn't start for most teams.
Theo Walcott - definitely doesn't start for most teams.
Nathan Tella - definitely doesn't start for most teams.


Or another way of approaching it: how many PL sides' attacking talent would you not swap that group for, setting aside wages, etc?

For me, all of the top ten are a given (Brighton's the only potentionally questionable one). it's very easy to say that you'd take Villa's, Everton's, and Leicester's attackers, without even so much as a thought.

Watford doesn't have the depth, but they have significantly more high-end talent. I'd probably make that trade. Leeds is debatable, but I'd put them in the same category...Bamford and Rafinha are a better duo than any we have.

It gets iffier after that, but if I had to rank the attacking talent of every side in the PL, we'd be somewhere in the bottom third. It's the sort of attackers you wouldn't be surprised to see on a team finishing 13th, but also the sort that you wouldn't be surprised to see get relegated, either. So expecting Ralph to coax the gang who can't shoot straight into a good forward line is a real ask.

 

Sort of changing the argument there. I said our first eleven. You've mentioned at least 4 or 5 players I don't consider to be in our first eleven. I agree with you focusing on our attack though, as that is clearly our weakest area.

Also, I said they are better than Championship-level, but you are comparing them to other Premier league players.

 

That's the point I'm making here. We have a reasonable defense and midfield, though we're fairly low on depth at CM. We have a bad attack. Taking everything together, you'd expect us to be a lower mid-table side that can get the ball into the opposition's half before wasting chances left and right, which is pretty much what we are. With a string of good fortune, we could end up 12th or some such; with a string of bad fortune, we could get relegated. That's not Ralph's fault, we just don't have enough quality.

 

Yep pretty much agree. I see us as a lower mid-table side, but not really one that should be in any real danger of the drop. Obviously that depends on other teams and injuries etc. But really, I think this team, even with the weak attack, has enough quality. I would very much consider it Ralph's fault if we finished bottom three. At the same time, I would also praise him if he got us to finish anywhere above twelfth place.

My main point though, was that labelling the team as 'mostly Championship-level', is unfair, imo.

 

Maybe? We have a few players who would be coveted by a great many clubs, but for the remainder, I'd probably rate most as in that midway point where they'd be a good player for an upper-tier Championship side, or a meh player for a lower-tier Premier League side. So both sides of the argument are right, really.

 

This is how I'd describe every team in the bottom half of the Prem, bar Leicester and Everton. But realistically, any of our first teamers would be the stand-out player for any Championship side. Redmond would score 15+ and get as many assists, and Bednarek would play like Van Dijk.