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Off Topic The "Discuss Anything Else" Thread

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by OddDog, Jun 23, 2013.

  1. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    If they are going to throw out any sports in the Olympics it should be the 3 day event and the dressage. The horse does all the work, yet the riders have the cheek to go up and collect the medals, like they are some sort of Olympic hero.

    The sport is usually dominated by wealthy people, who win mainly because they can afford a horse worth half a million pounds, not because they are great sports people :biggrin:
     
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  2. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    You make good points, KS, but I must confess I do enjoy the medals these people win for us! To beat the Erics at Dressage was monumental IMHO.
     
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  3. Cyclonic

    Cyclonic Well Hung Member

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    Jesus Shergy, that means all those so called great jockeys are nothing but overblown tossers. :)
     
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  4. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    Horse racing is different, as the horse actually gets most of credit, the horse goes down as the race winner and the jockeys only get a small cut of the prize money. The jockeys do get abit of credit, but they all accept that without the horse they wouldn't be able to win. Average jockeys will still win races if riding talented horses.

    You mean the medals the horses win for us, I'd have no problem with it if the horse actually got the credit for the medal, but the riders are the ones who are awarded the medals, and go down in the record books as the winners. I don't think you should get a medal for sitting on the back of a talented horse :biggrin:
     
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  5. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    I'm not a dressage fan Shergs as I prefer competitive events rather than judging events, but the horse doesn't do all the work. The rider is instructing the horse all the time (with minimal movement) and has probably spent years training the horse to that level. The rapport in that event is incredible; that i can appreciate, along with the beauty and grace of the horse.

    As for wealthy people dominating the sport, that is true to a large extent but mainly as far as the owners of the horses are concerned. Many of the riders were not rich and got the rides because of their ability. The World No 1 show jumping rider used to compete in the same classes as my daughter and was a good friend There was nothing rich or posh about him but by having his riding ability recognised and being given good horses to ride he has climbed the ranks and through hard work and dedication has "made it".
     
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  6. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    I think that the great dressage horses are more remembered than who rode them Shergs.

    "GREATEST DRESSAGE HORSES EVER
    For the 15th edition we would like to celebrate and learn from the greatest dressage horses of history. Ten horses have been selected based on the criteria of winning an individual gold medal at Olympic Games or World Championships or winning the World Cup Final.

    During the Global Dressage Forum we will honour and look back at the great achievements of six of these horses. We will invite the rider, owner, breeder or groom and learn their personal story and the real character of these elite stars including what made these horses so special and what made them better than their opponents.

    The dressage community voted for the following six horses to step under the 2015 GDF spotlight!


    Valegro and Charlotte Dujardin Ahlerich and Reinier Klimke
    Bonfire and Anky van Grunsven Totilas and Edward Gal
    Matador and Kyra Kyrklund Salinero and Anky van Grunsven"
     
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  7. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    I'm not doubting that some of the riders are skilful, but without a talented horse they'd have no chance, it's the same with a race riding jockey, without a talented horse they wouldn't be able to win big races, no matter how skilful they are in the saddle.

    Sam Willie Cohen beat Tony McCoy and Ruby Walsh to win the 2011 Gold Cup, does that make him a more skilled rider than them?

    They may be giving the horse instructions in dressage but the horse is the one carrying them out and doing all the moves. So I can't agree that the rider deserves to be awarded a medal.

    I actually don't have a problem with dressage as a sport, I just think it should be the horse who's name is on the leaderboards , and who's name is introduced as they come out. The horse should also be recognised as the medal winner, not the rider.

    As far as the last bit is concerned I was probably stereotyping abit, but I'm sure there have been plenty of average riders win medals at Olympic Games based on the fact they can afford a great horse, and pay for it to be trained by expert trainers. Obviously there are some exceptions like the guy you know, but there is no doubting that having a lot of money gives you a giant leg up in equestrian sports at the Olympics. As you are only as good as the horse your riding :biggrin:
     
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  8. King Shergar

    King Shergar Well-Known Member

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    Well any time I have watched it during the Olympics there is very little to no mention of the horses, it's all about the rider. It's the riders name thats introduced, and is on the leaderboards. When its the horse doing the dance moves, or jumping round the obstacle course :biggrin:
     
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    Last edited: Aug 4, 2015
  9. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    True you can't win on an average horse. But, put the wrong rider on a horse and it can go backwards (ability wise). The horse and rider combination is the most important thing. An average rider on a top show jumper (or dressage horse) will never win a Gold Medal by the way. Many riders, can only ride one way and need the right type of horse to get the best out of it. The best riders can adapt to any type of horse and, by understanding the horse, can adjust their style to get the best from the horse (ie get the horse to want to do it, rather than make it do it).

    So you need a top horse, and I agree 100% that without a rich owner it's unlikely (but not impossible) to get one. Without a rich owner you may be lucky enough to breed your own and produce it to the level required. It has been done. Also, some horses, thought to be average, can turn out to be World class. Why? Because they were only considered average because the rider was crap and the horse was never able to show its potential with that rider. The precision required at that level in show jumping and dressage can only be achieved with an excellent rider on top.

    Thinking about it, you can only have a top football team if the owners are filthy rich and buy the best players

    Re announcing the winners in dressage, I didn't realise they give the main credit to the rider (not a great watcher of that event). In show jumping it's the horse, ridden by .... (as in horse racing). I agree it should be same in dressage.
     
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  10. Cyclonic

    Cyclonic Well Hung Member

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    That settles it then, dressage out, frisbee in.

    Gold Medal: Underhand. Blue Environmental Plastic Orbital Disc. Hurler. Hungerford P. Jones. Canada. <applause>
     
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  11. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Ron has answered this for me, with authority.The top Dressage riders have great skill which takes years and years to develop. They fully deserve their medals, as do the horses, with whom the prizes are shared. Didn't you know that? :emoticon-0100-smile
     
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  12. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but wadda bout de dog? Hurler/Dog Handler: (as advised). Dog: Gertraud von Lechbruch (usually known as Sniffy).
     
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  13. QuarterMoonII

    QuarterMoonII Economist

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    I would have thought that you would have wanted Netball bringing into the Olympics, Cyc, given the total domination of the sport by the Aussie Sheilas... you have won ten of the thirteen Netball World Cups and you are hosting it this month.

    If we could swap the Frisbee for a pie tray, we have a few people who can throw them...
     
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  14. bayernkenny

    bayernkenny Well-Known Member

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    I would like the local central belt of Scotland sport of 'The Jakey Walk' introduced into both summer and winter Olympics. There is a special brand of 'ned' who inhabits certain parts of Edinburgh and Glasgow who wear strange coloured Adidas/Nike track suits throughout the year and walk in a particular manner. This calls for the lower body to remain steady and the shoulders to militarily and continuously sway(almost to a two time beat) while making their way down their local boulevards. During the weekend evenings the most extreme and swanky exponents of this gait saunter into the centre of the two major conurbations of the central belt and exhibit their 'moves'. It is no more or no less as magnificent as the movement of a Dressage cuddy and rider.
    Like all 'sports' where particular countries are the only true exponent of that exercise they clean up at the Olympics. This would be 'our' medal goldmine. Unfortunately the medal haul would, because of the referendum result in September, have to be 'shared' with the United Kingdom as a whole.
     
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    Last edited: Aug 5, 2015
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  15. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    Oh no. If only someone would have thought of that before the referendum. People just don't think things through.
     
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  16. bayernkenny

    bayernkenny Well-Known Member

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    From information gleaned from the few true exponents of the 'JW' I know they all voted 'NO' in the 'reffy'.
     
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  17. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    'Rumba Tech' from the Gipsy Kings. Some pretty spectacular guitar playing and percussion work here:

     
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  18. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    ....oh, just one more. I don't think anyone performs "Volare" quite like the Gipsy Kings. The old boy here does it just like a flamenco singer. Some nice looking gals in the audience too................

     
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  19. Cyclonic

    Cyclonic Well Hung Member

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    No crappy B doubles in outback Oz. A real man's outfit. <laugh>

     
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  20. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Good grief, how long does it take to get from Melbourne to Darwin with this lot, one year+??
     
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