Grand Prix thread ARAMCO UNITED STATES GRAND PRIX 2022

**** me.

For what.... not being a daddy's boy?

 

There is a lot of hypocrisy around it.

It was a good race but this has spoilt it a bit now.

1) he got penalised because of his loose mirror. But what about Russell and perez.

2) They should have dealt with it during the race with a orange and black flag. This a huge penalty without warning.

3) why is this 30 seconds and George got 5 for knocking Sainz out the race and Hamilton 10 for punting Verstappen out in Silverstone last year.

 

Did they black and orange flag alonso to get the wing mirror fixed? if they did not they've no right after.

They didn't hit perez with a fine and he lost a part.

They didn't hit verstappen and he had another front tyre cover broken. (how many of these "standard" parts have we now seen broken on cars?)

Someone else had a broken wing end plate as well.

30 seconds for an items falling off is in theory not terrible as the danger is what happened to massa years ago. however they were totally inconsistent in the penalty by car AND to make it worse they only gave stroll a 3 place grid penalty for causing an accident by jinking into another car. Alonso's could have flipped or gone over fence there on another day

It seems HAAS were the ones protesting, which sounds like ferrari sent them out to complain. they hit at perez and alonso as as per perez gets no penalty why???

I find this crazy stuff. at least be consistent between driver in the same race.

FFS there were teams putting gaffer tape on the rear wing of a car on a high speed track earlier in season which was absolutely crazy.

 

I can see Haas's point of view though. KMag has had 2 or 3 flags out to come in to pits to secure body work costing them potential points.
Either flapping bodywork is allowed on the cars while racing or it's not!
Should be a simple one to be consistent.

 

It should be. But to absolutely savage one car and not the other is amazing. Perez had his end plate fly off. We all saw it.

 

I just don't understand how they can be so unable to identify and consistently deal with things like this during the race. Utterly hopeless.

 

To try and answer these:
1) Perez/Red Bull argued that the damage to his front wing wasn't structural, and didn't compromise the integrity of the wing. So it wasn't dangerous. There was also only a couple of laps between the damage and the winglet flying off, so there wasn't time or even a pitstop for the team to assess. I presume Russell/Mercedes would make the same argument about structural integrity. Alonso in contrast pitted immediately after sustaining damage, where it could have been assessed, and then drove for multiple laps with it flapping around before it finally came off. A car missing a winglet is not considered unsafe to drive, whilst mirrors are a critical piece of safety equipment.

2) Completely agree, but equally the teams have a responsibility enshrined in the International Sporting Code to ensure the car is always raced in a safe state. Race Control can't see all possible damage to the car that teams can.

3) Incidents are judged up to the moment of collision, and (in theory) the outcome is not considered unless there's clear intent. Lap 1 (and in particular Turn 1) see extra leniency because the sheer chaos of that moment means things are going to happen. Russell's mistake to hit Sainz was very minor, and exacerbated by Sainz making a late change of direction which was difficult to anticipate. It's unfortunate for Sainz that it was race-ending, but that's not relevant to the penalty. In contrast, the Alonso penalty reflects a safety issue which would have required a pitstop to address. The penalty therefore has to be at least equivalent to a drive-through, otherwise teams are encouraged to race unsafe cars and gamble on the penalty post-race.

 

No idea whether you're right or wrong, but the FIA should read your post as an example of how to clearly and respectfully explain their considerations, rationales and decisions.

 

So in the same point of view... Alonsos wing mirror fell off so that too was rendering his car safe?

Looking at the onboard it doesn't look like the wing mirror was loose after the crash and probably wasn't loose when he made it to the pits.

This has all came about because of HAAS where they had a loose end plate and were penalised so end plates loose were a problem then but not in this race?

 

a) Parts fling off cars going 180mph are unsafe for following cars and potentially stewards etc. doesn't mater if its a wing, tyre cover or mirror. to hammer one team for one and not the other is patently unfair.

b) sorry but Russell steams up the inside of trun one knowing cars would indeed be turning back in from wide (as in taking the normal racing line!) and he goes straight on. where exactly does he think cars will come from bar that direction. that argument doesn't hold up. he's screwed the pooch thee and took out the ferrari so should get a penalty.

c) Yes teams and drivers are supposed to look to safety

exhibit a

Baku GP and tapes up split rear wing. Absolutely lethal but allowed?

This is all about consistency.

Yes alonso's mirror is a massive hazard to following cars and yes if you lose one you are driving blind on one side, but lets not ever kid ourselves hat a US team walked into a US steward's room and got a USA decision that just happened to benefit a Haas driver.


We all heard brundle hammer on about perez's front wing for a few laps cos he was affecting the mercs. Its not like we didn't.

Nobody mentioning the broken front tyre deflector on Verstappen's car being broken and flapping. no penalty there. (that could break off and spin down the track like a guillotine.

Realistically just have some consistency.

 

Also HAAS lodged their protest after the deadline apparently...

 

Why did Toto put an illegal front wing with outwash vanes (which prevents other cars following close) outside the Merc garage for Ted to film?

 

Yeah thats a good point. I was thinking.. I hope that illegal wing is listed in their budget

 

Spending money on parts that don`t even make it onto the car. But Toto says that it may need a few tweeks to use it in Mexico along with other upgrades

 

https://www.racefans.net/2022/10/25...th-having-a-legality-row-over-new-front-wing/

 

Alonso has been reinstated in 7th place and gets his points back after Alpines protest.

#JusticeForAlonso

 

Good

 

So RB find out there fate on today?
IMO, if it just ends up as a monetary fine, then I think it will just open the door to the cap being ignored in future.

 

That`s great news. I can`t imagine how they came up with a 30 second penalty anyway.Perhaps they just draw a number out of a hat.

 

I have no faith in the decision making of the FIA. The Ferrari incident a few years ago is another example. But that at least cost Ferrari for some seasons. I suspect RBR are going to get away more or less scot free.