Are Newcastle in debt?

Just like the thread title just wondering if they are in debt or are they making a profit and debt free?

 

They were around £140m in debt, but Ashley paid the banks off and let them have the loan on an interest free basis. So yes they are in debt to Ashley.

 

so he’s selling the club and only getting 160 million and his 140 loan back?

 

That’s about it, though I believe he may have repaid himself about £20m and reduced the debt a few years back, not certain about this, but if so it’s about £180m for the club and £120m for the debt repayment. Still a tidy profit on his £135m purchase.

 

In debt to the fat overlord. We will be truly debt free after this, as far as I am aware.

 

So your still in a good position really, I don’t think 300 is that much to ask for a premier league club.

 

It's a truly surreal situation and you have to remember Ashley is quite astute in business.

What are the new owners getting for their £300 million, it's hard to say.

The training ground isn't fit for top class players and needs £20 million to replace it. The projected cost was £10 million around 10 years ago.

The ground is rented and the stadium needs another £30 million as I've been told, it's in need of repair and renovation.

The squad is worth a certain amount but more would need spending especially on forwards, a physical midfield player and a PL standard replacement for the keeper.

You can easily look at £100 million to improve that squad and guarantee a top half finish imo.

The manager will have to be paid off and a new man brought in at double the salary.

The benefit is, in a nutshell, the TV rights and who knows what that may be under the circumstances.

It'll be interesting.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if they debt finance the whole thing anyway. Loads of companies and clubs are funded by the owner doing it that way.

Meanwhile, we're literally funded the complete opposite way and have sent £25m-£33m out the door at the worst possible time because our owners can't afford to debt finance us. Debt isn't a bad thing, particularly to an owner or founder. Unmanageable debt like we had to a third party is bad.

****s me off every time I think about it.

 

I'd like to think so.

The 300 million is OK value. As well as the playing squad we have a need for investment in our facilities. The fat overlord has left the club with terrible provisions more akin to a non league side.

I guess we shall see what happens going forwards. I'm being embarrassed by the mbappe and coutinho claims by fans though as not all of them are in jest sadly

 

Agree with this except for the goalkeeper. Dubravka is, in my opinion, a very good goalkeeper. He has saved us in matches numerous times this season.

 

I like him but the back ups are nowhere near good enough and he's early 30's.

So, if you're looking for someone to challenge him for that shirt, you need someone mid twenties and at the top of his game.

 

Ah sorry mate. I think I've misread your post! You're right we need a capable stand in for him

 

I think even with massive investment your Gona be looking at around 4/5 years at least before you can challenge for the European spots imo.

 

Definitely. Those above us will be spending and improving too. To be honest I'd be happy with not fearing relegation every season and being competitive

 

£100m only gets you 2 players now though - is that all tyou think they need for a top half? I think they need full backs and a striker. And a 10-15 goal PL striker will cost £100m nowadays on his own. Admittedly I don't watch enough of them to know for certain what they need but I reckon you need over £200m for a top half finish and, as far as I'm aware, FFP guidelines say you can't spend what you don't earn (or something like that)

Rules have changed to stop people doing an Abrmovic or Man City (or what they tried to do with Shepherd et al) and simply buying the league. I don't know the rules but I'm fairly sure they can;t just go and spend £200m without showing their ways of making that much money back from other avenues.

 

Yes mate, I said £100 million easily and that's net spend with a few stagglers out of the door.

I'm only talking about top half which is mid table where Palace and Burnley are.

Each step up, from there, and staying there costs more and more incrementally ...

... and, as you say, the cost of fees, agents and wages becomes astronomical.

 

I may regret saying this when the season kicks off but our first choice defence and keeper are already good enough for mid table or higher (we are currently in amongst the mid-table group, wer're 6 points ahead of the team in 15th and only 5 behind the likes of Arsenal and Tottenham in 8/9th) but our midfield is a much lower quality. However much "potential" the Longstaffs may have it says a lot that we look a better team when Shelvey comes back in. Our wingers are a handful (Saint-Maximan has been awesome, his stats don't back up the fact that he terrifies defences and creates gaps and opportunites for others, he's our best forward player by a mile) but our "striker" is a shambles.

Even with Rondon up front this season instead of Joelinton I reckon we'd be at least 5 points and possibly more higher up the table so top half isn't that big a leap. Add in one (or two) central midfielders of the quality of others in our team (that is mid-table quality) and we should be able to be confident fighting for top 10. I certainly don't think we're miles behind the likes of Crystal Palace or Burnley.

Getting above about 7th/8th though is a different story. You need a mixture of good investment and luck. Of our current players I'd say we have 3 who I think could be goo enough for a place in those top teams (Saint-Maximan, Dubravka and Schar) so you're looking at 15-20 players at an average cost of what £40-£50m? Getting on for a billion pounds to compete with the top echelons of the league. That sort of thing would take season after season of investment and would have zero guarantees. Even if we are bought out by multi-billionaires with dreams of winning something I reckon they'd realise pretty quickly that it isn't realistic for it to happen any time soon.

I'd be happy with mid-table and cup runs. I'd be ecstatic with being like Wolves or Leicester right now. I'm expecting an initial promise and outlay followed by a gradual dwindling of interest and mid-table grinding - IF we even get bought.

 

As regards the OP.

My understanding is that about £120m is still outstanding but that we have £20-30m in the black in the coffers (the second figure is far more subjective and given the current situation perhaps should be disregarded). Concerning the money owed to Ashley there are 2 correct points to make 1) he doesn't charge ANY interest on that money 2) He does get a lot of free advertising and merchandising from the club is siphoned off to his other interests rather than going to the club itself. Depending on your views on Ashley different people place more emphasis on 1) or 2) whereas realistically they are both relevant.

I think originally the loan was a huge benefit to NUFC and is too often overlooked by fans wanting to have a go at him but now the interest on that loan is worth less by some margin than the money we would be getting for the advertising and merchandising (some people suggest the gap to be in the tens of millions but it's so hard to say without guesswork).

Ashley did save us from sticky financial times, Shepherd and Hall needed to bail. He could have done better for us but we could have done much worse too. To turn a profit on a football club in this day and age is a minor miracle. Can't stand the guy though for a hundred reasons, many nothing to do with football or NUFC but I do think it's too lazy/easy to paint him as the anti-christ and ignore the positives.

 

A few good points there, but another way to look at it is that the defence looks half decent mainly due to the midfield sitting so deep to help them out. A more attacking style could leave them very exposed, so may need strengthening as well.

Sorry for going a bit off topic.

 

The club is profitable, I always heard that Ashley's debt was paid off, but even so he's about to get it paid off by the new owners so the club is now technically debt free. With advertising revenue that we previously did not take, and the ability to replace fun88 with Saudi Aramco as the shirt sponsors they can increase the clubs revenue by considerable amounts.

The debt issue has always been odd, because if Ashley wanted too he could rip down those ghastly Sports Direct signs, take some hard cash from sponsors and just pay it off. Instead he doesn't seem to give a ****.

Strengthening is not something that concerns me with the finances being touted, we just need a capable and mature manager who will not misuse funds. I think picking a new manager is the absolute key important decision that has to be made.