Off Topic Art & Literature

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by Beddytare, Nov 26, 2019.

  1. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    My son loved Notes From The Underground, I just found it very introspective, with no discernable narrative. It might be a bit of a Marmite read.

    I took both The Gambler and Crime and Punishment mostly as political; allegory. So as well as working as a character, Raskalnikof has to carry the burden of Dostoevsky's conviction; that, basically, the end does not justify the means. And that reason (in the age of reasopn) has it's limitations, especially when it collides with traditional morality. I still sympathised with him, but did end up wondering if he, and I, might be sociopaths.

    We spoke about War and Peace before I think. I certainly wouldn't have expected to sympathise with a bunch of Russian artistos either, but I absolutely did. Maybe because Tolstoy is such a compassionate, humane writer. I don't see it as a book with separate themes; each theme is one thread that is woven into the richest tapestry in all of literature.
    All of literature besides Shakespeare, anyway, and Shakespeare never attempted to fit all of creation in a single play - though I think he pretty much encompassed everything in creation over the course of his life.

    I would call War and Peace a flawless, complete recreation of a complex multi-faceted world. Someone,can't remember who, once said that if the world itself could write, it would write like Tolstoy. But I didn't read it til I was over 50, that might have helped. Decades ago, I hasd a conversation with a Catalan farmer who was raving about Cervantes' Don Quixote. He was insistent that I wait til I was over 50 before reading that one (I haven't, yet, so I don't know if he was right).

    As for Solzhenitsyn's nationalism (notwithstanding almost all Russians are prone to intense nationalist sentiment anyway); I wouldn't let any writer's dodgy political views put me off reading them. Ezra Pound is probably the outstanding poet of a very blessed generation, for example; Joseph Conrad's views on race wouldn't really stand close scrutiny (though I think it would be wrong to call him racist).
     
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  2. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    I was really into Russian literature in a big way back in my uni days. I read everything by Dostoevsky and was kind of obsessed with him. Crime and Punishment is not his best novel, but I can understand why it's become his best known. For me Brothers Karamazov and Demons are the best two of his longer novels. I didn't really like The Idiot. Of his short novels, part one of Notes From Underground is just a beautiful read, but you really have to 'get' Dostoevsky and his whole personal life and outlook to appreciate it.

    Reading Tolstoy after Dostoevsky was to me a huge disappointment. Got halfway through War and Peace and gave up through boredom. Haven't bothered with any others of his. Seems to me that Tolstoy is a good storyteller, but he doesn't come close to Dostoevsky in terms of representing all the dark and negative aspects of a person's psychology. On top of that I just think Dostoevsky's way with words is far more poetic than Tolstoy's.

    Dostoevsky was a philosopher too, but without blowing his horn as one. He was ahead of his time in terms of portraying the existential condition, and he was able to do it much better than Sartre, Camus and all the rest who became associated with it much later on. He was allegedly Nietzsche's favourite writer too, and you can see so many connections between the two of them. Dostoevsky wrote groundbreaking philosophy, but did it through the novel form, which is why he isn't given the same credit as the others, who defined and labelled it all etc.

    Regarding other Russians, it's a long time ago so I struggle to remember, but certainly Turgenev and Chekhov spring to mind.

    I definitely have to attempt War and Peace again though.
     
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  3. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    Just have to say, the Catalan farmer is right. Don Quixote is my new favourite book (read it this year), and I recommend it to all classic literature lovers that I know. It's pure brilliance. Don't wait any longer to read that one.
     
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  4. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    Didn't even see this until I posted above. I think we have a very similar taste regarding these two!
     
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  5. fatletiss

    fatletiss Well-Known Member

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    Yes, me too. I forgot that one.
     
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  6. billy ball sack

    billy ball sack Well-Known Member

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    Katie Price. Great autobiography and shameful plugging as she may need a few of you to buy a copy.

    Great rack, too.
     
    #86
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  7. billy ball sack

    billy ball sack Well-Known Member

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    Book rack, that is.
     
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  8. Libby

    Libby Not606's Top Interviewee

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    As nobody has bothered to respond to me I'm assuming I can post off topic threads from now on.


    Cheers <ok>
     
    #88
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  9. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    Where did Saddam Hussein keep his books?










    In Iraq.
     
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  10. West Kent Saint

    West Kent Saint Well-Known Member

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    Some of you guys enjoyed The Road, and I’m wondering if you have read much else by Cormac McCarthy. The border trilogy or Blood Meridian? Blood meridian is particularly dark!
     
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  11. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Actually libby . I was going to post this earlier .

    . What about having an arts thread ? That would combine Music , literature , films an TV ?

    Mods any thoughts / Saints Alive ?
     
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  12. Beddytare

    Beddytare Plays the percentage

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    I would suggest you check with us first....................I just thought that as there was a music thread....I would see if there was any interest in a book thread. I didn't just put it up I did discuss whether there would be any interest. I can close just as easy...........If enough object I will do just that.

    Libby if you do not like the way this Forum is running then don't bother to post..........What a lot of you don't see is what happens behind the scenes. That includes complaints and other suggestions.
     
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  13. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    Why on earth are people getting in a kerfuffle about a book thread? I’d have thought there were greater things to waste energy getting annoyed about.

    I think it’s a lovely idea, for what it’s worth.

    I you don’t like it, don’t go on it (much as I don’t go in the politics thread).
     
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  14. thereisonlyoneno7

    thereisonlyoneno7 Well-Known Member

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    To me I quite like this thread, as I am always looking for new things to read.

    Anyway, I have never read War and Peace and this thread has given me the inspiration to do so - what translation does anyone recommend?
     
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  15. Rorschach's Journal

    Rorschach's Journal Well-Known Member

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    I read about half a dozen or so - Suttree, The Border Trilogy, No Country for old men and a couple more. Enjoyed them so might give Blood Meridian a go if I can squeeze it into my crammed reading list. I quite like "Dark" so my interest is piqued
    Edit. Just bought Blood Meridian. Will give it a read at the wedkend
     
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  16. Beddytare

    Beddytare Plays the percentage

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    There is a local Author who has written local mystery novels. She used to live in Hedge End. I actually met her just after her first Novel was printed probably about 5/6 years ago While on holiday in the Canaries maybe even a tad longer.She was celebrating her first book release. Anyone remember her name by any chance? For the life of me although I have read I think about 4 of her books neither my wife nor I can remember her name.
     
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  17. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Touch harsh on Libby there I think ?
     
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  18. Beddytare

    Beddytare Plays the percentage

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    I'm not trying to be harsh..........Why harsh? Stirring things up just because he has had something rejected perhaps?............This is a football Forum not a general discussion Forum. However if anyone wants to print something that might be of interest to the whole of the Forum then Check with us the moderators. That is how we have the various threads stickied. But not every day events other than football related subjects. We are not going to turn this Forum into a general discussion Forum!!!!!!
     
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  19. Kaito

    Kaito Well-Known Member

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    Penguin Deluxe Classic by Anthony Briggs seems to be the modern Penguin preference. The older Penguin version I read was by Rosemary Edwards. It's a stunning read. Have fun.
     
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  20. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Well you honestly seem a bit ott in this instance imho .

    He just asked a question , he had nothing rejected . Anyway , this forum is a bloody good place .
     
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