Oh how ridiculous!?

Discussion in 'Watford' started by Scullion, Nov 6, 2019.

  1. Scullion

    Scullion Well-Known Member

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    I often see reports of things were political correctness has resulted in actions by people and organisations who have completely lost all sense of reason or common sense.

    Some of these things are just plain amusing :biggrin: others make us go <doh> and some make us mad <steam> cry :emoticon-0106-cryin or speechless :emoticon-0127-lipss

    Of course PC is different for all of us personally but post what you find and let other comment or discuss.

    This is my first thread so I hope it gets past the mods.
     
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  2. superhorns

    superhorns Well-Known Member

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    Do you have any examples Scully?
     
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  3. Scullion

    Scullion Well-Known Member

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    My starter for ten and what made me think of this thread.

    In a recent copy of the DT with the headline "Sign of the times as Little White Town alters label"

    Bedeford in Devon is know as "The Little White Town" a tag that was given to it by Charles Kingsley in his 1855 novel Westward Ho! Many of the houses in the town are painted white, hence the tag line.

    Due to complaints from parishoners' a motion was put forward by the Conservative group leader to remove the tag completely from town signs as it could be seen as a racist slur and the council classed as racist white supremacists!

    How you get from a literary description of a town with white painted houses to a white supremacist council is an enormous leap of imagination. <doh>

    In the end the tag has been changed to Charles Kingsley's Little White Town (1855).

    So now I am wondering about:
    The White Cliffs of Dover
    Blackburn Rovers
    George Brown
    Yellowhammer (a bird)
    the list is endless....
     
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  4. Scullion

    Scullion Well-Known Member

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    Writing one as you comment, I am sure you will find some too :emoticon-0105-wink:
     
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  5. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    Well a few examples - housewives are now to be known as Domestic Engineers. Fat people are now to be known as Metabolic Overachievers. A sex change operation is now a Gender Reassignment, and a bisexual prostitute is an 'Equal opportunity sex worker'.
    I get the point about history Scully. Some of the older classics of literature are no longer used in schools because they are not multi cultural and do not represent a broad spead of modern society which modern children can relate to - so Jane Austen is out, along with several others. On the other hand the way we use language is important - one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist. Governments which are opposed to the UK are known as regimes, and their leaders are 'dictators'.
     
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  6. yorkshirehornet

    yorkshirehornet Well-Known Member

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  7. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    I think we need to be more specific here. Generally speaking we are referring to language intended to avoid offense or disadvantage to members of particular groups in society - with a preference for inclusive language. Whereby the solution is maybe not the language used but rather not seeing the person you are speaking to, or about, as being anything other than a fellow member of the human race - and thereafter seeing him/her only as an individual, and not as a member of anything.

    The other side of 'political correctness' may be ''right-wing political correctness'' - otherwise known as ''newspeak'' - designed to make it impossible to talk, and possibly even think, about ideas which challenge the established order. So, opponents of your country become terrorists, their governments become regimes and their leaders dictators. ''Self made men'' is used for people who became rich and the taking over of the World by market force capitalism is known as ''Globalization''. Liberal political correctness is to avoid discrimination and right-wing political correctness is either to restrict the ideas circulating in a society or to promote ''patriotic correctness''.

    So which are we talking about here ? Or can we take it in any direction we choose ?
     
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  8. Toby

    Toby GC's Life Coach

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    It's a term used by right-wingers to discredit the efforts made to make society more inclusive. Anyone that uses the expression 'it's PC gone mad' deserves a slap imho.

    For example:

    People wanting Gollywogs to be considered acceptable
    People getting irrationally annoyed by people expressing their sexuality/gender differently to the traditional terms
    People wanting to use racist nicknames for certain groups (like newsagent owners or Chinese takeaways)
    People hating attempts by schools to reduce bullying and ensuring all kids have an enjoyable experience
    etc...

    It's mostly used by people that call others 'snowflakes'. Predominantly men of a certain age angry that the world around them has changed.
     
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  9. yorkshirehornet

    yorkshirehornet Well-Known Member

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    Given that people are getting chucked out of the labour party for not being politically correct.. Should the same principle not be applied to those in other parties who belittle the poor?

    Of course not...

    I worked for twenty years in a university one of the most pc social institutions.. And paradoxically held up to be bastions of free speech..
     
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  10. HHTFC1

    HHTFC1 Active Member

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    To a level I agree, but I would be interested in your opinion on
    1) retrospective action against people that expressed a view previously, which at the time was acceptable to society, but is now seen to be completely abhorrent? they do not express that view today, but it is part of their historical makeup
    2) Is a black person calling a white person 'Milky' or 'Whitey' acceptable?
    3) A person that had a Gollywog as a favourite toy in the early 70's, and that they see it as just that ,a toy, and have no issues with showing it to their children it as a toy they used to play with with
    4) Do you agree that positive discrimination is equally as bad as discrimination?
    5) Was David Silva's snaction for joking with Mendy appropriate, even though Mendy had no issue with it?

    I am genuinely interested in peoples views here.....things are never black and white, but what we do risk as we evolve, for the better I feel, we have to respect that we all have a history and we all have (i think that is fair) ways and language that some might find offensive whilst others who could be offended are completely fine with.

    BTW, this could be a great thread, but let's not turn this political please or you will only get the usual few commenting on it
     
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  11. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    1. I would say that retrospective action is not to be applied - the law cannot be applied retrospectively so why should this be ok. 40 years ago teachers and headmasters thought it was normal. and necessary, to beat kids repeatedly with canes - are we going to take them all to court 40 years later ?
    2. No it's not - if it's not ok in one direction it's not ok in the other. However - we need uniform rules here - if derogatory words for people of Afro Caribbean origins or Pakistani or Jewish people are demonized, then it should be right across the board.
    3. For me this is ok. What matters is the emotions behind the act, and not necessarily the act itself.
    4. Positive discrimination is a difficult one. In the German Green Party we have a rule that every second candidate on every list (for council seats etc.) should be a woman - is this ok ? if there are equal numbers of applicants from both sexes but not otherwise. Positions like this should be picked on ability alone. I don't think I would ever want to be picked for a job only because of a quota system. Sometimes we have gone too far on this and we need to step back and acknowledge that some jobs are more likely to be male jobs and some more likely to be female - what is important is equal recognition. We have more men teaching in Universities and more women teaching in nursery schools is that a problem ? Only if there is a large pay difference. Laughably enough there is currently a legal issue to try to force the French Foreign Legion to accept women ! Needless to say they are not impressed with the idea.
    5. Can't actually remember what Silva said.
     
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  12. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
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    Last night I was reading the diary of a very left wing politician, and the year was 1944. He was training in Rhodesia and his language about some of the native population was exactly the same derogatory terms that Johnson has come out with. Seventy years on and still some wish to be hurtful to minority groups, but apart from educating children that this sort language is wrong, I don't know what you do apart from show up current parts of the population for what they really are, including politicians.
    The word that I grew up with, manhole, for some reason is not to be used these days. An inspection pit or cover is now the in word.
     
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  13. HHTFC1

    HHTFC1 Active Member

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  14. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
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    Batsman has now become batter. Sounds very ugly unless you are thinking about fish and chips.
    Actress is now an actor unless they rebel and say they still wish to be known as being available for female roles.
    Such pc stuff is not given much thought here. Because nouns are either masculine or feminine we are used to the fact that there are differences, even if you cannot always remember which is which.
     
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  15. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    I would say that if Mendy wasn't offended by it and if Silva knew that Mendy wouldn't be offended by it that there are more important things going on in this World. This could also raise the issue of culture - if a person moves to another country and doesn't live by the political correctness of that country then can it really be judged in the same way ? For example the ''N'' word in Spanish has a different connotation to when used in English.
     
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  16. colognehornet

    colognehornet Well-Known Member

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    It's the same in German Frenchie - every profession has a male and a female form. I feel sorry for the leading politicians from the SPD here who have to begin speeches with ''Lieber Genossen und Genossinen'' not easy if beer is flowing.
     
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  17. Scullion

    Scullion Well-Known Member

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  18. Scullion

    Scullion Well-Known Member

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    I think the thread can take any direction, I started it but do not own it. I was hoping it would point out some of the sillyness of extreme PC, be amusing when finding certain examples and informative from any discussion that ensues.
    I do not want this to become a left wing/right wing battleground.
     
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  19. Scullion

    Scullion Well-Known Member

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    I have tried to learn a few languages and find it very frustrating and I thought the other day that if, for example, in French we deem a door feminine, is this not sexist for the door which has no say in the matter?
    I have never understood why nouns need to be sexed, the word is THE and I wish languages that use masculine and feminine pro nouns need to get a grip and decide they are all neuter and make life easier for us all. But I digress as this could be another new thread.
     
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  20. oldfrenchhorn

    oldfrenchhorn Well-Known Member
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    After 12 years of living out here I still have not found an answer to how you can have bread that is female as in la Baguette, or male as in le pain. Ask and you will probably get a shrug and be told that is just how it is.
     
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