Pardew got it wrong...massively wrong.

Discussion in 'Newcastle United' started by Graham Carr's Binoculars, Dec 5, 2013.

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  1. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    I know you're hurting but saying that you were the better side and that "In the first 45 mins the whole stadium would have been entitled to ask for their money back." is frankly bollocks. 235 passes to your 33 in the first half alone. We were running rings around you. OK we didn't create enough but we were still adapting to the loss of yet another front man. We deservedly beat you without our two main goal threats in Bony and Michu. Shelvey ran the show and even your own fans were saying you were outplayed ('ripped apart' is too strong).

    That was Laudrup's assessment and I think he's a man who knows his onions.

    It's common to have these forum inquests after a loss but sometimes you just have to credit the opposition and not look too much further than that. That was our best home performance of the season. You're right about the stadium though. The fans are very quiet and nervy of late. Not good.

    The Toon will have a decent season imo but I really don't like Pardew and I'm not convinced he's tactically astute enough at this level.
     
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  2. mancgeordie1892

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    I agree you deserved the win but the 3-0 was very flattering. The second was a fluke, and the third Shelvey shouldn't have been on the pitch. If you factor in the handball in the area then it could have been a different game. And that was coming from a Swansea fan I used to work with.
     
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  3. Graham Carr's Binoculars

    Graham Carr's Binoculars Well-Known Member

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    Not debating you had all the ball first half mate and you did run rings around us. Problem is that those rings were being run on the halfway line. It was a boring first half.

    Pardew's game plan worked first half even though it was dull to watch. You scored with your only real chance and that was due to a big error from our keeper.

    You having no front man helped you. It effectively gave you 6 in midfield to our 4 which is why Pardew's set up was never going to work.

    Second half until your goal we were looking the better team and the more likely to score. Had two strong penalty appeals, the hand ball was a stonewall pen and 10 seconds after the second penalty appeal you made it 2-0 with a lucky finish.

    You deserved the win, but I'd say by one goal not three and pretty much every major decision and break went your way (two pens, red card and the own goal). It was just one of those nights for us and Pardew started it all off with his team selection and formation.

    Well done on the win but nobody will convince me that the first half was anything but boring.

    Edit: I said we were the better team for the first twenty mins of the second half (which we were), not the entire game.
     
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  4. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    Fine margins at this level I guess.
     
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  5. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    Really disappointed. Pards had a bad night and poor game for first time this season. Unless Santon and Willo had knocks it made no sense whatsoever. To me they looked 2 subs made based on some statistical anaylsis of output levels and some other guff. We were getting beat FFS! That ****e is for before the game when balancing out what lies ahead. We didn't do that and took the easy decision for me. The brave thing to do last night was freshen us up with 4 or 5 coming in. Fair enough Cisse and HBA were not available but use someone else.

    As for Obertan, just no more. The lad is trying, unfortunately in more ways than one. Sissoko had a poor game and just seemed to throw te toys out when it wasn't going his way. His pass selection was terrible all night. Krul was utter gash and at fault for the first and third goals. I didn't mind the tactical side of things. Suck the life out of them first half and then step up second. Krul's **** up obviously hurt us there and gave them momentum at the wrong time. However surely it would have been better to have the likes of Anita etc do the hard yards first half?

    I thougt we got it all wrong and paid a heavy price. Yes it was a pen the handball, yes we had chances, but I'd find it hard to say Swansea didn't deserve their win. They did and played well. I just feel we contributed to our own downfall with safe selection, poor subs and poor individual performances/errors.
     
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  6. Graham Carr's Binoculars

    Graham Carr's Binoculars Well-Known Member

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    Surely he must bring Anita in on Saturday?

    Can't see that he will though. If he doesn't trust him enough to play at Swansea away why would he trust him at Old Trafford?

    Like you said, very disappointing all round.
     
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  7. The mighty DeBOOSHy

    The mighty DeBOOSHy Active Member

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    This is a classic Swansea fan delusion. Possession in your own half means jack all. Anyone can do that. How many touches did you actually have inside our box in the first half? I'd hazard a guess at 10?

    Would hate to watch that football every week, it's soooo dull. Whilst Newcastle don't always play the best technical football, I do like our direct style, and it worked well last month.

    3-0 obviously flattered swansea yesterday, but we were poor and didn't deserve anything in the end.
     
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  8. Kifflom!

    Kifflom! Well-Known Member

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    Yes we only had 10 touches in your half <doh> Please. If "anyone can do it" why didn't your players? If you enjoy your "direct" style of play (I'm not convinced it is btw) then maybe you admire Stoke - or Cardiff?

    Our style of play is what it is and is admired by most fans of other clubs and pundits alike. We play short passes patiently looking for an opening. Occasionally we'll throw in a killer long ball or a defence splitting long pass (Pozuelo to Shelvey for the second last night) just to vary things. This isn't for everyone I know. I've heard Toon fans groan en masse when your team passes it back on live TV. Depends how knowledgable your fans are and their expectations I suppose. Hoofing it forward to a big lump like Shola isn't what we do and it's not what our fans want or expect. If you prefer that then good for you.

    But saying you were poor and not giving credit to the opposition is a classic delusion of the fan of a losing team. <ok>
     
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  9. G4rdToonArmy

    G4rdToonArmy Well-Known Member

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    Completely agree with the OP, we had plenty of options instead of running the team into the ground midweek before the manure game at the weekend. Everyone looked knackered and Shola was as much use as a chocolate teapot, which personally i put down to fatigue.

    This would be my only complaint with Pardew, no forward thinking and his subsititions are shocking.

    Honestly think we're screwed vs manure now but fingers crossed for a point.
     
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  10. Graham Carr's Binoculars

    Graham Carr's Binoculars Well-Known Member

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    He said 10 touches in our box not half <ok>

    When people are angry they tend to type faster and make mistakes...take a breath fella <ok>

    We've also played the fewest long passes in the league so not as direct as you may think.
     
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  11. Agent Bruce

    Agent Bruce Well-Known Member

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    You need a brain for forward thinking, unfortunately Pardew ...................... better not say anymore or else I'll have Hacky on my back.
     
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  12. Graham Carr's Binoculars

    Graham Carr's Binoculars Well-Known Member

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    I think we have to accept that our aim is mid table and our manager is someone likely to achieve that aim but not take us any further (a mid table manager). He's pretty much exactly what Ashley wants, a manager who knows he'll never manage a club bigger than us so he's happy with the transfer budget, won't rock the boat etc.

    Pardew talks a good game about playing on the front foot etc but we don't do that. Our strategy is to sit deep, get bodies behind the ball and break. He's not a Martinez, Pochettino or a Laudrup, manager's that regardless of opposition play a style that takes the game to the opposition. Given we have Cabaye, Remy, Ben Arfa, Colo, Debuchy, Mbiwa, Anita etc we should/could be much prettier on the eye. We're not because of Pardew. He's a limited manager that sets his team up within those limits. It's not a slant at Pardew, it's just a fact that our aim is mid table and that's his level.

    If we had a more forward thinking manager I do think we could challenge the top 6, we still might. After Man Utd we have 3 very winnable games and we'll be pretty much exactly half way through the season. At that point we'll certainly know what kind of season we're in for.
     
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  13. Agent Bruce

    Agent Bruce Well-Known Member

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    I think Pards is more suited to managing teams like Millwall and Charlton, he could maybe do a good job for them and go back to his Cockney roots.
     
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  14. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    Even the best managers have poor games lads, nevermind Pardew. I think you have to judge each game in isolation at times and analyse the real reasons you get beat. Then suck it up and go again. our fans have this tendency to be a bit bi polar and jump off the deepend, start looking too much into one game. The jury is still out on him undoubtedly and there is no doubt last night was not a good night for him. Far too easy to write off the previous four games though which he showed he was a forward thinking manager as he won all four games with different tactics. Subtle differences as per the opposition.

    Again last night, tactically he was on the money for me. It did carry a risk and placed a great deal of importance on cutting out individual errors. Sadly the players had an off night and he, in my opinion, got the selection wrong. Whilst I accept we do not have a great squad at our disposal, I was disappointed by his lack of a pro active approach to managing the squad on this occasion.

    That said the vast majority on here thought we should go as we were prior to the game so he wasn't alone!

    Swansea may be getting a touch carried away as they were flattered, but their boss picked a team and tactic that worked out for them. I have no preference personally for the style of football adopted. Indeed I think at any level beneath the elite you have to cut your cloth. Swansea could try and play that way every game (I don't know if they do) but the harsh reality is against the best sides they'll come up short. Managers of clubs like ourselves and Swansea have to not get too carried away with their footballing principles. You have to adapt to the situ. Last night worked out for them as they played ourselves (a mid to lower table side), try that against the top 6, you'll get tanned most weeks. In isolation though, the best team and manager on the night won.
     
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  15. Graham Carr's Binoculars

    Graham Carr's Binoculars Well-Known Member

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    He is forward thinking in that he does have a noticeable game plan for msot games, especially away from home.

    I don't however think he's an attack minded manager, something that he often claims to be. I can't remember us away from home imposing ourselves upon the opposition for a long time. Where as Everton, Swansea, Southampton all do this regardless of whether they're home or away and who they're facing.

    I do find Swansea quite dull to watch, as they do play at a slow pace and often sideways. However they do play this system well. Southampton and Everton though look to play forward, and at a fast pace whilst also keeping the ball on the deck. I do think we have the players to do this and would like us to go to Old Trafford and force the issue, especially with Rooney and RVP missing.

    We won't do that though, regardless of if we go 4-4-2 or 4-3-3 etc the game plan will be to stay compact, ride our luck a bit like we did at Spurs (I accept against the top sides you do need to do this at times) and try to nick a goal. Not saying that's wrong, just that it would be nice for Pardew to have confidence in our midfield to control the tempo of the game sometimes.
     
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  16. 2010 tops dog

    2010 tops dog Well-Known Member

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    Frustrated we dropped points against a team we should expected to at least get a point.
     
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  17. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    I have to say I don't have that confidence against the bigger sides. I too would like us take a greater share of possession at times, like we did for long spells against West Brom. We tried to earlier in the campaign though and I felt we weren't getting the most of our personnel by doing so. Maybe the coaching is not as good, that may be a valid point.

    That said Southampton and Swansea may try this with success but against the top sides away from home I thinks its dificult. More so for Swansea than Southampton who do have signigicant resources. Therefore I don't think a one size fits all approach is good at a certain level. I think if you have the resources and the players the elite club have, then yeah its a necessity. Class will tell.

    Even Everton who I rate as a top side this season, don't really dominate possession and dictate the pace of the game against the top sides. I have watched them against the likes of Man U, Chelsea, Man C, Spurs, Liverpool and they have either had to concede possession/dictation of play (away from home mainly) or take little more than an equal share. With all due respect to ourselves, they have a much better side so we have some way to go.

    All in all long term I remain on the fence about Pards but I think the situation at board level prevents us from sacking him off. We are not going to go and get a Laudrup, Martinez, Rodgers. Its just not Ashleys way. Therefore in terms of what we have available to us, I'd be slightly reticent to go demanding change.
     
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  18. DragonPhilljack

    DragonPhilljack Well-Known Member

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    You looked a gift horse in the mouth lads, for sure! Very few Jacks were expecting anything yesterday, we had no strikers, we had one of our worst runs ever, and we've had every refereeing decision up until last night go against us this season, so I can only conclude that the footballing gods smiled on us last night, and David slew Goliath! Have a very prosperous season lads, hope you smash United, they are there for the taking, crap this season!.................<cheers>




    I think we Tooned you!.....................<laugh>
     
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  19. Agent Bruce

    Agent Bruce Well-Known Member

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    Toon in on Saturday to find out how we tanned Man Utd.
     
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  20. Atticus

    Atticus New Member

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    Good assessment. Better than most of the bollocks on here.
     
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