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Saints Academy Thread

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by - Doing The Lambert Walk, Aug 18, 2014.

  1. SAINTOSPREY

    SAINTOSPREY Well-Known Member

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    U21's 1 down 82nd minute. That's how it finished.
     
    #5201
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2021
  2. Ronnie Hotdog (MLsfc)

    Ronnie Hotdog (MLsfc) Well-Known Member

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    I don't follow them that closely, mainly just keep an eye on their results but our youth team over the past couple of seasons really seem to be a crock of ****e.
     
    #5202
  3. saintrichie123

    saintrichie123 Well-Known Member

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  4. SaintInKuwait

    SaintInKuwait Well-Known Member

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    What we’re doing with Olly Lancashire is so fascinating to me. I wish it had more of a measurable outcome because I think the theory makes so much sense. I’d hope he at least comes out of it with a better Wikipedia page photo though. Poor bugger isn’t even in focus!
    70CC0608-7BE2-42AB-A186-6B3CEF900E9A.jpeg
     
    #5204
  5. SAINTOSPREY

    SAINTOSPREY Well-Known Member

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    B Team lost 2 - 0 Lewis was sent off in the first half.
     
    #5205
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2021
  6. mowgli

    mowgli Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, the sending off pretty much ruined the game from our point of view. Defence stepped up too early for the first goal leaving 3 or 4 Burnley players totally alone in the penalty area deciding amongst themselves who was going to tap it in the net. The second was a poor mans JWP free kick that Wright will have been disappointed to concede after saving an earlier penalty.

    Overall there was lot of good individual skill from a few Saints players but as a team they were very poor. It's the basics they seem to miss. No neat triangles. No periods of extended possession. Poor first touches. Lots of balls played into 'space' but as Burnley kept the game very tight in midfield, they effectively became 50-50 balls.

    Simeu was the best player on the pitch by a country mile. A performance marred by a silly yellow for 'reacting' at the end. Good performances from Chauke and Watts. Small and Doyle definitely showed a lot of promise for the future. But my MOTM would have to go to Dominic Ballard who, despite being marked by a guy at least a foot taller than him, caused a lot of problems up front and drew the best save of the game from their keeper. He and Simeu were the only players I saw leaving the pitch with very little left in the tank.

    One player I've not seen before who I like a lot was Joshua Lett who replaced Small half way through the second half (suggesting possibly that Small will play a part against Sheffield Utd?)
     
    #5206
  7. saintrichie123

    saintrichie123 Well-Known Member

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  8. SAINTOSPREY

    SAINTOSPREY Well-Known Member

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    1 down after 2 minutes. 2 down in injury time first half. 3 down 53 minutes. 4 down 72 minutes.
    6 down 86 minutes. 0 - 6 FT.
     
    #5208
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2021
  9. Saints Fan4Life

    Saints Fan4Life Well-Known Member

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    I really wonder about that U23 manager, he clearly isn't up to the job.
     
    #5209
    Dark Lord SFC likes this.
  10. Dark Lord SFC

    Dark Lord SFC Well-Known Member

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    Anybody know how much the academy costs to run on an annual basis?
    Based on the last ten years investment, there have been limited results of top players joining the first team
     
    #5210

  11. Saints Fan4Life

    Saints Fan4Life Well-Known Member

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  12. SaintInKuwait

    SaintInKuwait Well-Known Member

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    You are all out of your minds. :emoticon-0102-bigsm
     
    #5212
  13. Saints Fan4Life

    Saints Fan4Life Well-Known Member

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    It's not just about producing players for our first team though. If we're making money on these players, whoever they end up playing for,then it's very worthwhile you'd imagine. The football league is littered with our academy graduates though granted, majority were released rather than sold.

    Callum Slattery joined Motherwell this summer for a fee. Alex Jankewitz, Michael Obafemi to name a couple more. We've even just lost a teenage kid to Man City for a fair sum, so I think it's financially paying for itself.
     
    #5213
  14. mowgli

    mowgli Well-Known Member

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    He needs to turn things around soon for sure, for his own sake. But to keep things in perspective these cup games are very much men against boys. Not sure that the experience is worth the knock in confidence! We need to remember that the B team has been rebuilt close season in the same way as the first team. The difference is Ralph can shield players until they are ready. Horseman is forced to throw them straight in. Also, tonights game featured at least 3 players from the U18s. Harry Lewis was suspended... Simeu and Small both missing from the back line...
     
    #5214
  15. Dark Lord SFC

    Dark Lord SFC Well-Known Member

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    In recent year the majority of our kids have left on frees to League One, Two and National league clubs
    Obafemi left for a pittance to Swansea
    Like to see the accounts of cost vs sales income, I suspect it doesn't look good
     
    #5215
  16. mowgli

    mowgli Well-Known Member

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    I seem to remember the break even point was having one academy player breaking into the first team each season. There have been times over the last couple of seasons when we've had half the first team made up from academy graduates. This season you can count Tella and JWP. Arguably Stephens and Walcott as well. Tella being the 'break through'.
     
    #5216
  17. SaintInKuwait

    SaintInKuwait Well-Known Member

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    I appreciate the theory you are proposing, but last year Reed went for £6m plus add ons. The year before, Targett went for £10m+ and Gallagher for £5m. We’re probably shifting JWP for £50m next year! Tella emerged as a real threat last year too. We have Stephens and JWP who are players that we could not have afforded as they are, we built quality that can be in our team for 8-10 years. Cutting the academy would be massively harmful (to the reputation too) and I’m sure it would not save the kind of money that sees the first team have a noticeable budget increase.

    I still maintain that we should have found roles for Reed and Targett but that’s also part of Crocker’s remit now. He has to guarantee pathways that haven’t been there in recent years. It helps if we can find a way to not be fighting the drop every year too though!

    Honestly, the misery and doom over youth team results is the stupidest thing. Youth football is a team sport, but individual development is an individual event. I have said this on this very thread over and over, but these results barely matter. Lallana, Bale, Walcott, Sparv, Best, Dyer. That vintage team. That’s an exception, not the rule, but even they didn’t win a trophy. Dave McGoldrick was preposterously dominant at this level and then went on to be a non-scoring forward who only got to the Premier League in his thirties. These results are not really that predictive of future successes.
     
    #5217
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  18. SAINTOSPREY

    SAINTOSPREY Well-Known Member

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    Under 18's 1 down at half time at Crystal Palace.

    Finished 1 - 0 to Palace.
     
    #5218
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2021
  19. Dark Lord SFC

    Dark Lord SFC Well-Known Member

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    But how much does the academy actually cost to run?
     
    #5219
  20. SaintInKuwait

    SaintInKuwait Well-Known Member

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    If you’re able to find a concrete figure I’d love to see it. Your mileage is going to vary across academy types and with different clubs within Category One. Chelsea and City have the most expensive academies in the country by far that run at an estimated cost of £8m a year. I’m certain that ours is *significantly* less than that and we also receive grants for it from the Premier League and the FA.

    In the days of “The Orchard Homes Academy” cost was estimated at about £1m a year. If ours is, say £4m (still feels too high of an estimate to me, just given our comparative player and staff numbers, plus Chelsea and City will have “youth” on much larger contracts than we do) then just having Tella emerge is a break even because you’re now in possession of an asset worth more than the cost of running the facility. If we had signed Tella from the Championship last year, his contract and fee would likely have been much higher.

    The clubs who made the choice to bin their academy were a handful of lower league clubs and Brentford. Normally I’d say that anything Brentford does should be something we all consider. However it only made sense because the cost of them upgrading into a Cat 1 academy was massive at that time and they had just been promoted to the Championship. If they weren’t Cat 1, then they could have lost any developed players for six figure sums without even a fight due to EPPP.

    The income isn’t just our direct sales and the opportunity cost of not having to sign a young forward/winger. Every player who has come through to be a professional is worth money to the club for the remainder of their career. If, for example, Callum Slattery gets signed to another team for a fee, Southampton gets a percentage. Even without a sell on agreed. We get cash just from having funded his early development in solidarity payments.
     
    #5220

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