Match Day Thread Southampton v West Ham Saturday 5:30PM

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by Saintmagic, Dec 9, 2019.

  1. ChilcoSaint

    ChilcoSaint Lives in a Chilcohüttl
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    Fair comment. Ralph has made big mistakes, I think we all agree, but I think they’re borne out of frustration and desperation at the poor material he has to work with, rather than incompetence.
     
    #601
  2. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    Key word there. Confidence.

    If anyone is a confidence player, it’s Redmond. I think Djenepo is very similar in that regard. Now yes, some of that is down to the manager, but there’s rather more to it than just that. I feel like he’s incredibly low on confidence too.
     
    #602
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  3. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    Ralph's pedigree is better than our squads, to be Frank.

    He achieved great things in Germany, and he has improved players in his time here.

    They have dropped off recently, but he had Redmond, JWP and PEH playing really well last season. He has given youth a chance, the players still play for him after everything.

    What other manager could lose 9-0, and still retain the respect of the players? They are clearly still playing for him.
     
    #603
  4. SotonOldBoy

    SotonOldBoy Well-Known Member

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    you took the quote right out of my laptop
     
    #604
  5. SotonOldBoy

    SotonOldBoy Well-Known Member

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    I think the players should get a pay cut because" their low on confidence", that would wake them up and get their confidence back.
     
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  6. SotonOldBoy

    SotonOldBoy Well-Known Member

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    I actually think Ralph is a decent manager but I also see why others want him sacked, but I am in the "what is the point" camp as I do not believe there is another manager who can get any consistency from this squad. Ralph knew of the players he had to try and get results out of, but we need to try some youngsters now, they have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Ralph was not the reason we lost to Arsenal, it was our poor finishing, the team actually played their hearts out. Ralph did not lose the Newcastle game, Redmond had two relatively simple chances to put us two up after 15 minutes but blew them, plus Bertie missing a sitter at 1-1. Our midfield and defense are not Premier League class and Ralph cannot change that with one transfer window and he had no support from the club in the last summer window. Saturday was a shambles but that it what we get from these players, half decent some games, a pile of **** the next. Its the reality that kills you, and the reality is we are doomed I tell you. If we go on a 5 game run please feel free to re-post.

    PS Another thing, the players lost the 9-0 game, that was the worst performance from a Saints team, no heart no fight and no guts, a bunch of over paid pussies wearing red and white.
     
    #606
  7. SaintinNZ

    SaintinNZ Well-Known Member

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    Well said that man.
     
    #607
  8. billyvegas

    billyvegas Well-Known Member

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    If it clearly isn’t RH fault, then it is us; the fans and also the hierarchy of the club that are making us play so badly.
     
    #608
  9. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    You are just cherry picking examples of player errors to back your point, but that’s illogical. Raheem Sterling makes mistakes sometimes. Every player does. You shouldn't blame a loss on the fact that one player missed a good opportunity to score. Because usually the other team has equal moments of importance. Arsenal missed enough chances too, remember? Every team does in every game, more or less.

    Who takes credit when a player wins the game with one move, a la Djenepo away to Sheff Utd? Sooner or later, if you just highlight these individual moments, then every result, win or lose, comes down to the players, and not the man in charge of them. So when are we actually supposed to discuss this man in charge?

    It's better to look at the overall performances. To use your example (Arsenal away), yes, we played very well. We played well in half a dozen other games too. However there are too many games in which we just aren't even competitive. As far back as West Ham away last season. Totally schooled. Burnley opening day of this season. Bompey home. Chelsea, Leicester, West Ham at home. There are simply too many examples.

    The whole squad-isn't-good-enough argument doesn't cut it for me. Brighton's squad is no better than ours, and yet, they took all three points away from the Emirates. Sheff Utd, Bournemouth and Burnley are no better than us, man to man. And, we are conveniently forgetting, Ralph had the chance to improve the squad in the summer. We spent 30m on two attacking players. Nothing on defenders.

    I actually believe there is decent bunch of lads in that squad who, managed well, can compete, and should be at worst, lower mid-table. In fact, they were doing this for the whole second half of last season. 7th place we finished, wasn't it (on post-Hughes results)?
     
    #609
  10. billyvegas

    billyvegas Well-Known Member

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    But is this the difference between a good and a great manager? I mean, you have to be adaptable to play to win, with the team at your disposal. Ralph did this last season to very good effect. This season it seems a case of my way or the highway. Well, we are losing almost every game. Do you or he think Championship players are going to play to his tactics better next season?

    And whilst I am not saying I want Allardyce, his early years were very good, he brought players like Okocha, Djorkev (sp), Campo and his teams were pretty attacking. Not all his sides play long ball **** football.
     
    #610

  11. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    Also, the weather hasn't been kind to us this season. Don't forget that.
     
    #611
  12. billyvegas

    billyvegas Well-Known Member

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    I think he is a fairly big part of it mate. He sets them out, ~I still think we have a pretty poor team, built we should be doing better than we are. Sadly, I think part of that is the tactics. I’m sure @shad did a points per game from Ralph last season and it was pretty good. He has changed something this year, and as Susan just pointed out, now he has Djenepo, Ings fit and on form, Redmond was on fire last season...
     
    #612
  13. billyvegas

    billyvegas Well-Known Member

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    I agree, in that the club is part of the problem, it cant be all of it.

    It is funny reading this forum atm - some think Ralpho needs to change tactics, but not many calling for his head (I’m not sure anyone actually is yet), and those who dont blame RH but blame the club. I think the truth likely sits somewhere in between.

    The club for many failing of supporting the manager in getting rid of players and failing to sign others, and Ralph for not getting the most out of this team (as he did last season). I’m not saying we should be in the top 6, but I still think this team us underperforming.

    I think the club must be thinking if we are still in touching distance by Jan 01st, they may look to get a couple of players (I get all the no money etc but Gao is a businessman and still thinks he will recognise he may need to put in a little to still have an investment). If we are not near the pack, I fear Ralph may be looking at the Everton job or similar.
     
    #613
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  14. billyvegas

    billyvegas Well-Known Member

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    He isn’t the only one - Ross Wilson is gone, Les Reed is gone, and i think others too.
     
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  15. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    On the whole I agree with everything you are posting. But, I would have to say, I don't think Ralph is regarded in anywhere near quite the same way by others, as he is with us Saints fans.

    His team is bottom three. He lost a game at home 9-0. These are the only things the Everton fans will acknowledge if Ralph's name is linked with their club, and they will have a f*cking riot.
     
    #615
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  16. billyvegas

    billyvegas Well-Known Member

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    Partly i agree, but i think he still has credit for what he achieved at Red Bull. I was only using as an example, as they are managerless. I can actually see Dunc getting that TIL end of season.
     
    #616
  17. Susan

    Susan Well-Known Member

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    Mods, can I do the Villa match thread? Never done one before, and I reckon I'm lucky as f*ck.
     
    #617
  18. Saintmagic

    Saintmagic Well-Known Member

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    I agree with you, but it would appear that we can't get rid of the playing staff and, as our whole model is sell to buy, that means we can't change them at the moment. So if that isn't an option at this time then the only option is to find a manager who get this group of players playing a way where they can survive in the PL. Some are saying they don't think that changing the manager would make a difference, I think it would.
     
    #618
  19. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    Change manager, hope for a slight bounce, if it materialises maybe scrape 17th. Rinse and repeat. Or go down under Fat Sam. Seriously, what’s the ****ing point.

    We have two players in that squad who are consistently PL standard, Bertrand and Ings. That’s it. Count them, two. The rest are makeweights really, one or two might progress, but none of them look up to this level. That’s why we’re struggling.
     
    #619
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  20. Saintmagic

    Saintmagic Well-Known Member

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    The point is to stay in the PL with the riches it brings. As Schad (I think) pointed out if we go down we would be royally ****ed financially, similar to the last time we went down. So for me the best option is to scrape by until we can get rid of the players we have and hope that our recruitment improves under Matt Hale so we can become half decent again, or we get new owners willing to invest some money.
     
    #620

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