Sunderland 'Til I Die II

Discussion in 'Sunderland' started by Blond Bombshell, Mar 4, 2020.

  1. Flash Gordon

    Flash Gordon Well-Known Member

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    Episode 6 Notes:

    Back to the church again, probably just bookends the 1st episode of season one with the last episode of season 2, but feels out of place.

    5-4 defeat to Coventry was a really ridiculous result in the context of that season.

    That little interview with Flanagan shows how difficult it is for us at this level. We're too big which brings its own pressure but we can't attract good enough players who can handle that pressure. The fan who had a go was a ****er mind.

    The interview with Baldwin was similar. He doesn't have the character to make it here and it's clear. Especially when you compare it to the positivity from O'Nien straight after.

    Interesting hearing Stewart Donalds partner speaking about how she doesn't like him owning the club, because of the abuse he gets from fans who don't understand what kind of man he is.

    The cameras on Donald at Fratton Park were brilliant. The bloke felt every emotion possible during that game.

    Disappointed that we only see a second of the Trafalgar Square shenanigans on play off final day.

    First time I've seen the playoff final game. It was my brother's wedding that day so I missed it and couldn't watch it after.

    Methven is spot on about the way we play and Ross always trying to defend a one goal lead and how we weren't psychologically equipped to manage that.

    That last second defeat is even more heartbreaking than I thought. The fan who's a soldier giving his kid a hug after the loss almost brought a tear to my eye.

    We were a better team last season than we are this season, it was such a missed opportunity.

    Charlie and Stewart are clearly emotional and gutted after the loss.

    Our club is ****ing special as are our fans.
     
    #101
  2. Flash Gordon

    Flash Gordon Well-Known Member

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    The people who come out looking good from this series:

    1) Stewart Donald
    2) Luke O'Nien
    3) The Fans

    The people who come out looking bad from this series:

    1) Charlie Methven (by a mile)
    2) Jack Ross
    3) Richard Hill
     
    #102
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  3. Kittenmittons

    Kittenmittons Well-Known Member

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    This sums up how weird the whole Short/Donald/Methven/Sartori thing is.

    20200402_213112.jpg
     
    #103
  4. Nacho

    Nacho Well-Known Member

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    Because he was too conservative in his approach or for another reason?
     
    #104
  5. Flash Gordon

    Flash Gordon Well-Known Member

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    That mate, the number of draws doomed us, he wasn't able to change games and I think the way it was edited, Charlie spotted it and called it out in front of the cameras a few times. The show makes it look like the manager was out of his depth, and in hindsight I don't disagree.
     
    #105
  6. Nacho

    Nacho Well-Known Member

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    I think he ran out of ideas in the end and the fear of failure gradually took hold, he could have done with more help from experienced hands. He's only a young manager not long ago finished with his playing career.

    We all know that he struggled towards the end of his time with us so a documentary showing that isn't shedding any new light. Donald said that turning the club around in a short space of time drained Ross and left him without the inspiration to push for promotion which rings true to me.

    Selling his one goalscorer and signing a dud didn't help much either.
     
    #106
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  7. Nads

    Nads Well-Known Member

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    What it did show was that he started to buckle sooner than we started talking about it.

    The signs were there far earlier but Maja was carrying us.
     
    #107
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  8. Nacho

    Nacho Well-Known Member

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    He was but if you can forgive the comparison Mourinho sets up conservative and relies on his Maja's to pull something out of the bag, unfortunately Ross didn't seem to have a plan B or anyone to suggest one to him.

    Part of him being an inexperienced manager probably, I think he'll have a good career. We tend to make excuses for players who come up from lower leagues and who struggle with the pressure but Ross came from St Mirren who are minnows compared to Sunderland and he actually did well right off the bat.
     
    #108
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  9. Nads

    Nads Well-Known Member

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    This was a thing though, Ross clearly didn’t rate Grigg, but he didn’t put anything into the convo (that we were shown anyway).

    None of us are football managers but we spoke about several players, Grigg got brief mentions but he was never who we would have suggested.

    I agree Ross will do well, but he was way short. The facts are whatever the circumstances he didn’t have it. We need a gaffer who has.

    We still don’t. Parky has done well with the physical side but he still hasn’t got a formula to mix it up.

    Daft as it seems looking at top gaffers, they can change it up. Even solid gaffers can. Playing to your strengths isn’t fail safe, another teams strengths could simply overpower yours. The signing of identikit midfielders has been one of our biggest handicaps and they have also flooded the payroll.

    Whether that’s on Ross, or the wiser recruitment team, who knows. For a start we need 3 less midfielders and at least one more striker but there’s no budget for it.

    We are a long way from where we need to be, but Ross was shrinking and he wasn’t going to turn it around, we were falling off. He did a good job to a point but you can’t make a good bottle last forever.
     
    #109
  10. Blond Bombshell

    Blond Bombshell Well-Known Member

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    I got banned over the road for suggesting that Ross was undermined by Donald. Haven't watched it yet so will reserve judgement
     
    #110

  11. Blond Bombshell

    Blond Bombshell Well-Known Member

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    Thought he was left powerless after the vacuum of Maja and used as a scapegoat by Donald

    Ross picks the signings in a certain podcast after the grigg fiasco
     
    #111
  12. Nads

    Nads Well-Known Member

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    Bit as the manager, the Maja thing ran and ran, it wasn’t like he had the last few days to prepare, his plan B should have started when there was the remotest possibility of losing the main man.

    I’m not fully blaming him, of course that wouldn’t be right or fair, But there’s no absolution either. He was the manager, the figurehead of the playing side of the club. He didn’t do enough.

    He didn’t inspire, we all could see the hands in pockets on the sidelines when the team was crying out for direction.
     
    #112
  13. Lucky19672

    Lucky19672 Member

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    Metheven's comments during and especially after the cup final defeat were EXACTLY what I said to my friend as we were sitting in Paddington after the match.

    Ross spent the game trying to hang onto a 1-0 lead. He should have been out of the door after that defeat IMO and certainly gone after the repeat performance against Charlton.

    CM had it spot on.
     
    #113
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  14. The Norton Cat

    The Norton Cat Well-Known Member

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    Without having seen the last couple of episodes, it was Maja leaving that screwed us over. Whoever's fault it was, Grigg wasn't a direct replacement for him. Ross stumbled on Maja, really, and so should have had a plan without him from the beginning.

    On the show, he says he doesn't feel Grigg was worth 1.25million, so why hadn't Hill and Coton identified realistic targets other than Marquis and Grigg? Obviously editing can make things look different to how they were in reality, but those two look like a complete waste of space.
     
    #114
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  15. Evil Jimmy Krankie

    Evil Jimmy Krankie Well-Known Member

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    The others with him on that clip is me, Mrs EJK and (now) Seaman EJK.
     
    #115
  16. Sunderpitt

    Sunderpitt Well-Known Member

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    My understanding was Ross would have kept Maja until the end of the season and did not want Grigg. Donald was the one who decided...ironic then that Ross got the boot?
     
    #116
  17. The Norton Cat

    The Norton Cat Well-Known Member

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    Seemed to me that Maja's agent was determined to move him on and there wasn't much that could be done by Donald or Ross. Having said that, Donald's mate Hill, who is about as much use as a cat flap in a submarine, made absolutely no attempt to keep Maja and absolutely no effort to identify decent targets to replace him.
    I think Ross was hampered by what that lot were doing, but he should have had some idea about what to do if he ended up without Maja.
     
    #117
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  18. RTB

    RTB Well-Known Member

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    Yep

     
    #118
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  19. Kittenmittons

    Kittenmittons Well-Known Member

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    I think Methven has played this whole thing very very well. I dislike him and in the context of what we know, I think we have every right to say he's a twat, incompetent etc, but for that first 9 months or so he knew exactly how to push our buttons and as much as it pains me, he comes across as 'effective' in his screen time.

    I suspect people who don't follow us or know the rest of the story will see him as a no bullshit 'steady the ship' type, when really he's a PR guy who specialises in selling magic beans to people with little substance. The open disdain for us hadn't really manifested until May or so when people started asking questions about the financial situation.
     
    #119
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  20. Nads

    Nads Well-Known Member

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    You can see why someone like Donald, who’s clearly a genuinely decent bloke, would get swept along with someone like him.

    Donald would be doing great if Charlie had the action to match the bluster.
     
    #120
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