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The Epsom Derby - June 4th 2022

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by OddDog, May 9, 2022.

  1. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    The 243rd running of the Epsom Derby will once again be sponsored by Cazoo - but that's enough of them - and will take place on Saturday, June 4th. As of today, 9th May, there are 43 of the original entries still declared but as we know, Luxembourg will sadly miss the race and, of course, others may be supplemented before the day of the race.

    A number of the key trials have now been run (York's Dante Stakes probably the only major trial still to come - more of that later) and the market is largely formed around those horses who emerged victorious from their trial.

    Current favourite (at around the 5/2 mark) is Aiden O'Brien's Stone Age. This son of Galileo took Sunday's Derby Trial Stakes (formerly the Derrinstown) at Leopardstown in impressive fashion, galloping strongly to the line to record a 5.5 length verdict over Glory Daze. Whilst this may have been the most authoritative trial victory it is perhaps not the strongest form-wise with the second having an official rating of just 98. Time will tell of course.

    With Luxembourg out, it may well be left to Roger Varian's Eydon to fly the flag for the 2000 Guineas form in the Derby but, whilst he did stay on to good effect at Newmarket, the jockey's comments that his mount became unbalanced in the dip on the Rowley Mile hardly inspire confidence for Epsom.

    One horse who has already shown he can handle Epsom is the Blue Riband Trial Stakes winner, Nahanni. John Gosden's handsome son of Frankel did it the hard way from the front and stayed on resolutely in the final 2 furlongs, repelling all challengers including subsequent Lingfield Derby Trial winner United Nations. Although this is the only trial that gives a horse experience of the unique Epsom undulations, I don't believe any horse has ever won this and the main event - Cracksman coming close a few years ago.

    Sandown's Classic Trial was won by Ralph Beckett's Westover from Cash and Goldspur and although the race has thrown up some great Derby winners (Bustino, Troy, Henbit, Shergar) it has lost popularity with the leading yards in recent years.

    Chester's Dee Stakes and Vase, both recognised Derby trials, were both taken by the Aiden O'Brien / Ryan Moore combination via Star Of India and Changingoftheguard and the latter is currently third favourite for Epsom at anywhere between 5/1 and 7/1. He absolutely smashed odds-on New London but I am a little wary of the form, given it was soft ground and Ryan Moore rode a superb tactical race.

    The springer in the market in recent days has been Sir Michael Stoute's Desert Crown - current favourite at around 2/1 for Thursday's Dante and a general 6/1 shot for Epsom glory. As always, the Dante will have a bearing on the Derby market and Desert Crown will potentially be joined by Magisterial (25/1 for the Derby) and Point Lonsdale (15th in the 2000 GNS and best-priced 16/1 for the Derby).

    Others worth a mention at the head of the betting include another O'Brien runner (but Donnacha's) in Piz Badile and impressive Newmarket scorer Nations Pride (who would need supplementing).

    With the usual plethora of Ballydoyle entries it is actually difficult to assess which one of theirs has the best chance - although Stone Age does indeed look a worthy favourite. But at much more rewarding odds I fancy an e/w ante post dabble on Nahanni at 25/1 (33/1 on the Betfair Exchange) who showed fine attributes to win the Blue Riband Trial.
     
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  2. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    All very 'foggy' at the moment, best to wait until Ballydoyle sort things out, don't think they know much themselves at the moment? The Dante race this week will certainly help, as a few will of course 'crash out'. Hope it's not Desert Crown! I really hate it when one trainer has six or seven declared runners in a major classic, but that's the way things are nowadays. The French system puts a stop to a lot of betting skulduggery by 'coupling' horses under the same ownership. That won't ever happen in the UK and Ireland though.
     
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  3. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    "The lads" seem to have more and more different colours with different joint owners added to the club. Swelling the coffers even further no doubt.
     
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  4. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Never thought of 'different joint owners', that 'sinks' the French 'coupling' system straight away! :(
     
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  5. Bustino74

    Bustino74 Thouroughbred Breed Enthusiast

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    What if all the Godolphin hopes fall over and they decide to run their 2000G winner?
     
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  6. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    Looked all over a miler to me Bustino. What does his pedigree say?
     
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  7. Bustino74

    Bustino74 Thouroughbred Breed Enthusiast

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    Maybe I'm alone in thinking this, but I'm astounded that no mention was made of the Derby after his Guineas win. Perhaps the 2000G has superseded the Derby as the stallion making race. I would think it is only recently that the 2000G winner wouldn't have a go at the Derby given half a chance of getting the trip. Maybe SheMo has lost the hunger for the Epsom race having won it twice.

    As regards his pedigree he traces back to a Nureyev half-sister to Balanchine (by Storm Bird and who won the Oaks and the Irish Derby). He's by Dubawi who has never sired a Derby winner but who finished 3rd in the race himself. He has sired plenty of 12f horses including Ghaiyyath, a really classy one. Coroebus's damsire is Teofilo (by Galileo), who given the chance should have stayed 12f. His great damsire is Dubai Destination who was the damsire of Golden Horn, and has mainly been a source of stamina despite being by Kingmambo (Golden Horn's sire was Cape Cross so hardly a source of stamina). The only weak link is possibly Nureyev but he was closely bred to Sadler's Wells, and it was more his style of racing than his pedigree that defined his stamina. So I think he has an excellent Derby pedigree.

    More than anything it's his style of racing I like and that makes me think he'll get 12f at Epsom. He's very relaxed and has a high cruising speed. He also has a change of gear. He should be going for the Derby.
     
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  8. Bustino74

    Bustino74 Thouroughbred Breed Enthusiast

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    Only 3 Derby Trials to go. The Dante today, one in Ireland at the weekend and then the Cocked Hat (used to be the Predominate) next week at Goodwood. It's all about Desert Crown today, it seems. By the undervalued Nathaniel out of a Green Desrt mare, who traces back to to a Whitney mare called Peace, who became one of Juddmonte's foundation mares. It may be symbolic that Peace's daughter Intermission was one of the first horses to put Stoute's name on the training map when he trained her to win the Cambridgeshire in 1976 (Jeremy Tree trained the filly but loaned her to Stoute as in that dry, hot summer he couldn't give her the preparation she needed on the Beckhampton gallops).
    Lots of promising colts in the trial today. Unless there's an outstanding winner then whoever does win it will still have to do a lot of improving today to get near being a Derby winner.
     
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  9. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Desert Crown didn't let me down! <ok>
     
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  10. Bustino74

    Bustino74 Thouroughbred Breed Enthusiast

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    From the way he ran today and his size I'd think Epsom would suit him. He'll also be a stronger colt by Derby day. Though I still think he'd struggle to beat Coroebus if he ran.
     
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  11. Sir Barney Chuckles

    Sir Barney Chuckles Who Dares Wins

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    Well the '22 renewal of The Derby certainly needed life breathing into it and cor blimey, team, it got that yesterday as Desert Crown ran away with the Dante. Awesome performance. Game, very much, now on...

    And let's hope we get another creditable challenger from one of the final couple of recognised Derby trials still to be run. Or alternative something appears from nowhere like Serpentine in '20.

    A quick note though re Nathaniel (sire of Desert Crown). To date 5 of his daughters have won at the highest level - most notably, of course, Enable. He is, though, yet to have a son win a Group 1 race.
     
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  12. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Gosh, and to think Coroebus was my choice for the 2000 Gns.! You have certainly convinced me that Coroebus will stay the Derby distance, didn't enter my calculations beforehand. I'm already 'on' with Desert Crown, so a 'saver' on Coroebus might well be a good thing!
     
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  13. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    I'd wait until he's been supplemented Swanny - you'd hate to back him and then they decide not to enter him
     
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  14. Bustino74

    Bustino74 Thouroughbred Breed Enthusiast

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    Yes, and don't listen to me.
     
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  15. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    .....but many of us do, Bustino! :emoticon-0100-smile
     
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  16. SwanHills

    SwanHills Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, Oddy, I learn something every day! I'll just stick with the one I'm already 'on', he should run a big race in the Derby.
     
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  17. Sir Barney Chuckles

    Sir Barney Chuckles Who Dares Wins

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    Re the last mention of these 3 races I see that the connections of Lysander are making positive noises about him and the Cocked Hat - and then, possibly, the Derby afterwards. Probably, as a result of what they have said the 3YO son of New Approach is 'blue' across the board on Oddschecker, at the time of writing, for the Epsom Classic - best price available is still as big as 50/1, though as low as 25's in a place.

    Lysander won his sole '22 start by 8.5 lengths and is a nicely bred sort with the dam a half-sister to Darasim (dual Group 2 winner). Lysander would need to make a massive leap forward to be considered a contender but Friday should tell us a lot more re this 120,000 gns purchase.
     
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  18. PNkt

    PNkt Well-Known Member

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    Latest scratching stage today. 21 remain

    Cazoo Derby (Epsom June 4)
    1 Buckaroo Joseph O'Brien
    2 Changingoftheguard Aidan O'Brien
    3 Desert Crown Sir Michael Stoute
    4 Eydon Roger Varian
    5 Glory Daze Andy Oliver
    6 Grand Alliance Charlie Fellowes
    7 Hoo Ya Mal Andrew Balding
    8 Ivy League Aidan O'Brien
    9 Lysander William Haggas
    10 Masekela Andrew Balding
    11 Nahanni Charlie Appleby
    12 Piz Badile Donnacha O'Brien
    13 Royal Patronage Charlie & Mark Johnston
    14 Sir Bob Parker David Menuisier
    15 Sonny Liston Charlie Hills
    16 Star Of India Aidan O'Brien
    17 Stone Age Aidan O'Brien
    18 United Nations Aidan O'Brien
    19 Walk Of Stars Charlie Appleby
    20 Westover Ralph Beckett
    21 West Wind Blows Simon & Ed Crisford
     
    #18
  19. Bustino74

    Bustino74 Thouroughbred Breed Enthusiast

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    Two Appleby entries. Is that it?
     
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  20. PNkt

    PNkt Well-Known Member

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    Supplemental stage on 30 May so we’ll see.
     
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