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The 'where is Manny' Singapore GP chat and predictions

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Big Ern, Sep 11, 2017.

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Who will take the chequered flag

Poll closed Sep 16, 2017.
  1. Lewis Hamilton

    13.3%
  2. Seb Vettel

    46.7%
  3. Valtieri Bottas

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  4. Kimi Raikonnen

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Danny Ricciardo

    20.0%
  6. Max Verstappen

    20.0%
  7. Jolyon Palmer

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Stirling Moss

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. Manny EMSC

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  10. Other (specify)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. cosicave

    cosicave Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, Eddie; I must have missed it.
     
    #281
  2. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    I'm not sure I saw the accident from that angle up until now. I'd assumed Kimi was up against the wall with his car over the white line and thought he'd been squeezed into the wall and that was what caused the chain reaction, now that I can see pretty much a cars width or more to his left before the wall, I can't help but think that, although a definite racing incident, if they were involved the insurance companies would blame Kimi as he was the only one who was aware of where the other 2 were. He must've known Vettel would move right because that is what every pole sitter has done since for years, he had the drop on both of them and could easily have led, so there was no need to squeeze.
     
    #282
  3. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    duplicated post.
     
    #283
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2017
  4. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    It actually looks like Max is a bit caught out by Kimi flying up the inside when you look at the onboard. I'm not sure he's fully aware of him until the last moment.

     
    #284
  5. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

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    From that clip Max hardly moved his steering left or right so it couldn't be his fault. I maintain the if Vettel didn't know Kimi was there both of them were bound to collide from their trajectory. Kimi was moving hard to the right and Vettel to the left...Vettel didn't know Kimi was there so I am sure he wouldn't have made the corner without contact
     
    #285
  6. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    It looks like Seb straightens out just before the contact, shockingly, Max is a completely innocent victim. the pole sitter always moves across so really the onus of blame has to fall on Kimi, who didn;t need to squeeze Max surely knowing Vettel woul be squeezing him from the other side. From Max's onboard it's clear he tries to pull out but really it was going to happen the moment Kimi moved right.
    A real shame, we could've had a proper race on our hands, as I don;t thin the Ferrari would've been as quick as either RBR or Merc in the conditions.
     
    #286
  7. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

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    One question for Cosi, Sgt, Smithers, BigE or any of the experienced guys.....are nose cones supposed to detach as easily as Vettel's did? You crash and lose your front wing, but the nose cone is that easy to separate? That's scary man.
     
    #287
  8. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    Not sure, been looking and it looks like 4 plugs clip from the nose into sockets on the chassis, I'd guess that these were spring-locked into place from a central mechanism that was fairly quick and easy to operate, but the plugs tight enough so it still needs a bit of a hard yank to come off. I think Vettels nose cone is broken, rather than unclipped. You certainly don;t want to be losing either wing, front is probably worse as can get caught under the wheels like happened in Ratzenberger's fatal accident. Rear isn't much fun either, Schumcher lost one at the end of a straight and started spinning uncontrollably around 200mph.
     
    #288
    dhel likes this.
  9. cosicave

    cosicave Well-Known Member

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    Yes, Dhel; nose cones are tested.
    –Not only do they form the most important part of the 'crumple zone', they are also tested with a lateral load just ahead of the mount points; and of course, if they pass the tests, they are legal.

    Testing cannot eliminate all possibility of detachment. Therefore, unless there was some unusual fault (including any weakness caused by an earlier incident, or not being properly secured when fitted to the car), one must presume that Vettel's nose cone underwent an impact exceeding the lateral loading of the tests.
     
    #289
    dhel likes this.
  10. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

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    It just looked a bit strange that it broke completely off though... I think I heard DiResta mentioning about it too and saying that they might have to do a little little explaining to the FIA concerning how easily the nose cone detached. But he didn't elaborate. Sometimes they need to explain stuff instead of just dropping it in a race assessment and just leaving it there.
     
    #290

  11. cosicave

    cosicave Well-Known Member

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    I agree.
    The tests are designed to make detachment unlikely. Without a nose cone, any further impact at the front of the car is dangerous in the extreme, since the driver is no longer adequately protected.

    As for it being mentioned by di Resta, good on him for doing so. However, I wouldn't blame the broadcasters. They have a limited amount of time with an awful lot to cover and directors need to make quick decisions on the fly.
     
    #291
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  12. SgtBhaji

    SgtBhaji Well-Known Member

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    Oh I wasn't trying to put blame on Max, but as he moves as Vettel covers I'm not sure he knew Kimi was coming up like a rocket who then also got in his space.

    There's a ton going on in that short space of time.
     
    #292
  13. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    As much as we've given them grief on here, a lot of those safety precautions were as a result of Bernie and Mosely taking control of the sport.

    (seems you've made me go green. hulk angry.)
     
    #293
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  14. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

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    I keep remembering seeing that guy Alexi..I think his name is.... in his car, going through the air with his legs protruding out the front of his car...that made my blood run cold...still cant get it out of my mind
     
    #294
  15. eddie_squidd

    eddie_squidd Well-Known Member

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    Alex Zanardi. An inspirational amazing man.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Zanardi
     
    #295
  16. BrightLampShade

    BrightLampShade Well-Known Member
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    I'm sure the FIA are already investigating. Had there been a secondary head on impact there would be no crumple zone and you'd be entirely relying on the integrity of the survival cell/chassis.

    Given the first impact was relatively minor there will be complaints that it entirely removed the nose.
     
    #296
  17. eddie_squidd

    eddie_squidd Well-Known Member

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    #297
  18. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, yes, that's the guy...I cant get that incident out of my head. There was one particular picture where he was in the air with his legs showing outside and at the right you could see all those people in the stands...it almost looks like a flying machine...and all I was thinking is the anguish and pain he must have been going through even before he landed, especially knowing his legs had absolutely no protection. And in all fairness to the three that crashed Sunday...we have the benefit of replays and slow motion, but these things happen very quickly and at high speeds. Even if your reflexes are the best, it's never quick enough most times.
     
    #298
  19. dhel

    dhel Well-Known Member

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    #299
  20. Big Ern

    Big Ern Lord, Master, Guru & Emperor

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    I remember that quite vividly, he was strapped into his seat looking like a broken rag-doll in the middle of the track with the car obliterated around him, I thought he was dead.
     
    #300

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