Transfer Rumours Transfer Rumours thread

Discussion in 'Liverpool' started by Bozz, Jun 17, 2011.

  1. moreinjuredthanowen

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    And it's an issue.

    We need a number 8 who chips in with 8-10 goals.

    Our issue in midfield is we simply go front to back and we dont get to see that player joining the box enough. Our primary route is full back to forward not a wide player cutting back to.midfielders joint box.
     
    #78081
  2. InBiscanWeTrust

    InBiscanWeTrust Rome, London, Paris, Rome, Istanbul, Madrid
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    We didn’t have a number 8 chip in with 10 goals last season.

    There are diff ways to win. A lot of teams who have attacking midfielders who chip in also don’t have full backs that are playing as wide forwards most of the game so they can have a midfielder pushed on further with less defensive responsibilities.
     
    #78082
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  3. moreinjuredthanowen

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    No we had vvd scoring headers and a lot of tightish games that a few more goals would have made really really comfortable.

    Look at the difference a player like mount brings to Chelsea.

    But yes there are very different ways to win absolutely.

    I'm just saying if two sit and one was joining the front 3 press (like ox did before injury) when we were at out best then that one ought to be able to score a few.

    Wijnaldum is an odd one, fires goals for Netherlands and is quite advanced at times for us but never shoots and plays safe. Wouldn't an upgrade be someone who can hit that target and had the confidence to join the box?

    Especially with a false 9 operating outside the box?
     
    #78083
  4. Zanjinho

    Zanjinho Boom!
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    VVD only got five, pretty sure CBs usually chip in with a few too so if he were covering the No.8 goals he'd need to be getting 12-15!
     
    #78084
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  5. moreinjuredthanowen

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    You lot deserve Jimmy's Brexit midfield <laugh>
     
    #78085
  6. organic red

    organic red Well-Known Member

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  7. Zanjinho

    Zanjinho Boom!
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    The midfielder's got 19 been them in the title winning season...

    Milner 2
    Hendo 4
    Fabinho 2
    Wijnaldum 4
    Oxlade 4
    Jones 1
    Keita 2

    ... that's alright for midfield, just been spread about.

    #thatswhatshesaid
     
    #78087
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  8. moreinjuredthanowen

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    That's a good contribution there. What it this year?

    I know mane is 10 goals down and firmino quite a few as well.
     
    #78088
  9. Zanjinho

    Zanjinho Boom!
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    They're all down, bar Salah
     
    #78089
  10. RogerisontheHunt

    RogerisontheHunt Well-Known Member

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    Theres a snag on how we pay apparently.

    Cause its a release clause RBL want the full lot up front. FSG however want to pay in installments.
     
    #78090
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  11. organic red

    organic red Well-Known Member

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    Edwards on the case...........we'll be fine
     
    #78091
  12. InBiscanWeTrust

    InBiscanWeTrust Rome, London, Paris, Rome, Istanbul, Madrid
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    This is the thing though, yes mount has scored a few from midfield. But chelsea top scorer in the league has 6 (Abraham, Jorginho mount and werner).

    Salah has 21. We have totally diff style and players who score our goals. Mane and Salah are our main goal threat, Bobby Chips in a bit and then midfield get a couple each ideally.

    If mount Jorginho were getting 6 each and werner pulisic/ziyech were getting 20 goals thrn sure, would agree maybe there is a way for us to get a goal scoring midfielder into the teams.

    Even united, Bruno has 18... next highest is rashford with 11, 2 more than mane. So it’s not as simple as just saying we’ll get a goal scoring midfielder into the team.

    you then lose that stability in the middle, the full backs push on less as they have to defend more (like we saw at middle of season with fab and Hendo in defence) and you therefore lose your creativity from wide. Yes you may gain some extra goals from midfield but you also thrn lose some goals from the wide strikers who are normally set up via the full backs.

    This team is a well oiled machine with every cog crucial to its success. Introducing a new type of player can have its benefits but it also has its downfalls if it does its own thing rather than keeping the rest of the wheels moving.
     
    #78092
  13. THE FOOL

    THE FOOL Well-Known Member

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    This is good.

    The midfield is set up to Harry and press teams, move the ball on once its won back quickly.

    Thaigo has been brought in to add more creativity and control once we've won the ball back, jones has also made the breakthrough which can add a more attacking threat.

    But regardless of who you are if your in the Liverpool midfield your primary job will be to stifle the opposition, peg them back, not give them an easy outball.

    The fact that we've lost the players to carry put the plan, doesn't negate the fact that this is how we play.
     
    #78093
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  14. Johnny Seven One Man Army

    Johnny Seven One Man Army Self-Partnered

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    This sort of highlights the problem to me - it's sort of like WW1 cavalry charging the enemy trenches and their machine-gun posts because we don't have another plan.
     
    #78094
  15. THE FOOL

    THE FOOL Well-Known Member

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    It's a conundrum.

    Do you change the entire ethos of how you play for one season, then try to go back to it?

    It's took years for klopp to perfect the system and get it to the point where we could sweep all before us, im unsure throwing it in the bin for a quick fix that may not work anyway would be the way forward.
     
    #78095
  16. Zanjinho

    Zanjinho Boom!
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    <party>
     
    #78096
  17. Zanjinho

    Zanjinho Boom!
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    It's not just the first team either, every level is setup to play exactly the same way.
     
    #78097
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  18. saintKlopp

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    It's not that we don't have a plan - it's that we have the horses and the people who ride them and can't make them into tanks and their drivers overnight and then back again to suit.
    Do you really think anyone has a Plan B as such? I think with the same set of players and the same manager the most you ever get are variations on a theme. If a manager has a set philosophy, a formula that works for him, and he's spent years coaching that into his players then a radical change of plan is unlikely.
    The odd time a manager does essay a totally different approach it's very noticeable, and rarely works, imo.
    I'm not advocating :headbang: when it's clearly not working, but I think we're unlikely to see a significant change in football philosophy, abandoning a tried and tested approach because it's hit a sticky patch. We do see an attempt at changes with the substitutions, but they're still within the same strategic formula, and I think that's true of all managers.
     
    #78098
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  19. moreinjuredthanowen

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    Well personally I would not confuse Chelsea's massive issue up front that's led them to 4th and lampards sacking with mounts strength.

    My point is why not add to our strength with another weapon from midfield? With crossing options from both sides and an empty box we have seen masses of issues scoring. A midfielder with the brain to join the box would be useful.imo.

    Frank Lampard
    Tim Cahill
    Paul scholes

    All had some ability at this and were all different

    Gerrards goals were very different but still had a few.

    If we could find someone with that instinct its be awesome.

    After all we all thought getting someone to pass and create would do the job but thiagos has made no difference.l, actually made it worse lol.
     
    #78099
  20. moreinjuredthanowen

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    I wouldn't say that.

    The game plan is to make the pitch small in the press. However this season the full back have been well back and we are not chasing on up front.

    Theres always an out ball that's easy and allows the opposition full backs time to turn.

    This is really the issue without the ball. Teams can get out if they have any ability (or want to) as we are more passive.

    But that doesn't explain fully the on the ball issues. We are getting the ball deeper without a press but we are also being slow in approach and taking extra touches and passes to get the ball into position so we are almost exclusively playing against set defenses.

    There are no strikers so we find trent wide with max one target in the box with salah on the touchline or firmino outside the box.

    I agree on the plan b stuff. Everyone has a system but ours needs to get the basics right. We leave space behind as we need to relay on making the pitch small so we can go quick and keep the play broken. After that we do need the means to exploit more tactics the opponent employs.

    For example if sides want to sit real deep it would be nice to have players who can get the ball on target when shooting or get a striker on who can play within the box (which origi ain't great at)

    Or midfielder who can play a forward pass . I think the only slipped in ball I recall was shaqiri to jota. Good goal too.

    Wijnaldum is a ball holder. He doesn't release the ball.
    Henderson likes a cross deep but isnt a passer either.
    Fabinho offers some shooting from deep and mixed it up.
    Milner wants to be a winger
    Keita wants to dribble.
    I'm not sure what jones really wants to do. I think hes played within himself at times as he can offer more shooting at least
    Shaqiri is not a midfielder, but has slipped the odd ball through.
    Thiago wants to be deep, he can dribble, he can pass but he doesn't seem to want to do it in advanced positions

    So my point is really how do you change a game doing the same things over and over?
     
    #78100

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