What is our level?

Discussion in 'Newcastle United' started by Albert's Chip Shop, Feb 23, 2020.

  1. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    See above answer
     
    #21
  2. Captain Chaos

    Captain Chaos Well-Known Member

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    Watch the football
     
    #22
  3. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    I don't need to. I watched the football under Rafa and it was clearly absolute garbage. He got the job done though. I simply hold all managers to the same criteria rather than altering the criteria to suit my favourites.
     
    #23
  4. Captain Chaos

    Captain Chaos Well-Known Member

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    I disagree... the team he left was doing well and scoring great goals through very effective counter attacking football. the defence was good also.. its taken a little time for bruce to destroy it , but its happened.
     
    #24
  5. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    The football was negative defensive football throughout his tenure. Horrible to watch in an attacking sense, for all you have to admire Rafa's ability to shut down the opposition. There has literally been hardly any change at all under Bruce. Same negative approach. Its not for me and I think Bruce and Rafa are wrong in their assertion you have to play this way to survive. Its just an excuse they use because other managers on similar budgets play far more attacking football and still survive. Bournemouth have played carpet football for years now, still there.

    You're entitled to disagree but I really think you should head to specsavers if you think we were entertained under Rafa. Just an absolutely nuts assertion and probably just more evidence of how much Ashley has lowered fans expectations.
     
    #25
  6. Captain Chaos

    Captain Chaos Well-Known Member

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    Who said entertained ? Norwich are entertaining btw
     
    #26
  7. Charlie Dogscock

    Charlie Dogscock Well-Known Member

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    And the stadium and fanbase of one of the biggest clubs in Europe....

    We aren't a championship side cos we're aren't in the championship, aren't in the relegation zone, and have only been in the championship 2 years out of the last 27 years.

    We're a club without higher aspirations than lower-midtable yes, but we ain't championship in any way.

    Man Utd have had lengthy stints of being dogshit since Ferguson left, but it still didn't stop them being one of the biggest clubs in the world.
     
    #27
  8. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    So if its not entertainment you want, and its not points, what is it you're after? Or will that depend on which criteria massages Rafa's balls?
     
    #28
  9. Captain Chaos

    Captain Chaos Well-Known Member

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    I want to see a side that is effective
     
    #29
  10. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    Bruce is having a very similar effect to Rafa so I take it you are right behind him then?
     
    #30

  11. Captain Chaos

    Captain Chaos Well-Known Member

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    bruce inherited the 7th best performing side in the prem minus perez a rondon

    however hes had

    40 million joelinton
    20 maximin
    andy carroll
    jetro willems
    danny rose
    bentaleb
    lazaro

    performances are not good enough, lack of squad rotation caused injuries .. 17th is the aim and under ashley even a top manager would struggle, but I know what Bruce is ... a crap manager
     
    #31
  12. Roland Deschain

    Roland Deschain Well-Known Member

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    Im not sure what you’re defending here, is it Mike Ashley? Steve Bruce? We’ve been in the championship twice in 10 years, let’s not bend numbers. We have been in a relegation battle another 2 or 3 times, so half the last decade has been spent either in, or trying to stay out of, the championship.

    As I clearly stated we are terminal relegation fighters, so again I’ve no clue as to what you’re defending or arguing about.
     
    #32
  13. Charlie Dogscock

    Charlie Dogscock Well-Known Member

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    I'm not bending numbers, the fact is we've been in the premiership 25 out of the last 27 years, twice in 10 years is a misleading statistic.

    I'm neither defending Ashley or Bruce, my point is that we are not a championship level club, we are clearly a premiership level club. Just cos we fight relegation regularly doesn't make us that level, a team like Everton have fought relegation on numerous occasions in the last 10 years, but it doesn't mean they're not premiership level.
     
    #33
  14. RobEllious

    RobEllious Well-Known Member

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    We are a prem level club who's recruitment and under-investment sees us go nearer and nearer to being a West Brom yo-yo club.

    We'll never do a Leeds, Sunderland (LOL) or even a Swansea, but we will never aspire to much more than around 10th as long as we stick to the buy low, sell high philosophy whilst not maximising any form of potential revenue. Long term we'll get left further and further behind the rest of the prem.

    We might have another lucky season and end up with some Ba, Cisse, Ben Arfa, Cabaye, Tiote situation but this gets harder and harder to do as clubs have wised up to our transfer tactic.

    More likely we'll just have more seasons like this: buy Joelinton as a Perez replacement, get ASM through the same agent and try Joelinton in the striker position with perma-crocks Carroll/Gayle as back-up. Another season of lop-sided recruitment and we're back in the Championship, where we will spend, spend, spend to go back up then spend **** all on improving a Championship team. Roughly the same to occur a few more years down the line.

    So anyway, I think we're lower-level Prem that will fall in to Championship eventually under current ownership.
     
    #34
  15. Roland Deschain

    Roland Deschain Well-Known Member

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    Precisely what I said.
     
    #35
  16. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    <laugh><laugh><laugh> That is the best attempt at Rafa Massaging I've ever come across. What sort of clownery is going on here.

    7th? No he inherited a squad which finished 13th end of story. He actually made us worse than the year before if you were being strict. So looking at the trend under Rafa you could argue that as long as Bruce finishes 16th or above, he'd be in keeping with the trend Rafa was on. I won't be that harsh though. Instead I'll keep it simple. After 38 games we will be able to judge how Bruce has performed in relation to his predecessor. 13th is the position he has to beat. In terms of entertainment, that's a subjective thing so you'll struggle to get to the bottom of that. However league positions have always been very clearcut. I mean you get the desperados who then clutch at points totals. But if that was the case then maybe we should have given Liverpool a PL trophy for last year, because with those points they'd normally have won it <doh>

    The desperate transfer diatribe has already been successfully shot down in flames several times so its not worth going over old ground.

    Imagine if Bruce keeps this lot up. You will have so much Rafa egg on your face you'll eating scrambled eggs for breakie, scotch eggs for lunch, and an omelette for your tea. All with a side of chorizo.
     
    #36
  17. Sharpe*

    Sharpe* Senior Member

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    You are where you are in the league.

    A lower level prem team fighting to avoid relegation.

    The club is obviously bigger but that's not reflected by what's on the pitch.
     
    #37
  18. Charlie Dogscock

    Charlie Dogscock Well-Known Member

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    Basically yeah, a club where the aim is to just stay up every year and which has been starved of any investment needed to take it to any higher level.

    But still a Premier league club, its wrong for anyone to term us championship standard when we've been on the Premier league 25 out of the last 27 years, and the 2 years that we were in the championship we stood out on both occasion as a Premier league quality side in a division that we were too good for.
     
    #38
  19. Warm Pouch

    Warm Pouch Better than JPF

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    Not under Bruce according to Rafa's Ball Massaging Army. We're actually championship or league one and he's just been lucky.
     
    #39
  20. Sharpe*

    Sharpe* Senior Member

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    Agreed.

    You're definitely a Premier League level team both in size of club and the fact you're literally in that league and have been for a long time.

    Everyone outside of Newcastle just looks on in bemusement at what is happening under Ashley.

    Every knows Newcastle can be a top 6 club given the right investment.

    Unfortunately though its not happening.

    The last decent Newcastle team I can think of was when you had Tiote, Cisse and Demba Ba.
     
    #40

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