Will we ever be a top performing club again?

Hi Reds,

What are your opinions on the current standing of our once great club?

It has been some time since we reigned supreme and even the more modern 'good old days' where we didn't actually win the league but settled for European challenges under Rafa seem like a lifetime ago, and our squad then much superior to that of now.

Do you think now we have Klopp we have a good chance of winning major silverware soon or do you think he will come and go like many managers before him?

Do we remain an upper middle team or do we become a contender again?

How long will it take us to compete if at all?

 

Next year is our year, you heard it here first*






*disclaimer - this may not be the first time you've heard that.

 

Sort out the defence and we'll look alot better (we've been saying this since Rafa went). There has been a few games this season we've been in a winning position to either draw or lose.
Imagine if we'd have been able to cling onto those leads, its likely we'd have had enough point to finish 5th.

This also means sorting out the Midfield, getting players who can cover and help the defence and to control the game when we're in a winning position (ie hold possession)

Get all the forwards, strikers, AM's fit and we're fine. Obvious problem there, them being all fit for most of the season. Hopefully now that Klopp's training is now in place and with a pre-season this should lessen. (Sturridge still being a worry as he's made of fine bone China)

I think if we get the transfers being talked about, see the transfer thread, plus maybe a couple of others (so 5-7 players), we could have a shot at top4. The lack of European football might be a help as well (yes its massively disappointing not to have Euro football), obvious factors like few of games and a more consistent team should be a benefit.
Its not about money, Man City and Utd have both spent hundred of millions and yet both teams are only marginally better than us in their finish this season. Buy the right players and build a team.

 

my view is quite simple.

IF FSG are making do then no, not under them

IF we build that 60k stadium upgrade and stop talking about 54k and then see
IF we go pay the going rate wages on this tv deal

IF we psend real time and not playing computer games when buying players

IF we give klpopp what he needs..

sure we can be.

 

What will be will be. If klopp gets them playing how he wants them to play then it will be entertaining to watch. I'd rather that and win ****all than be boring as ****.

 

We have two world class players. One can only play @ 60 mins every other game, and the other is a fine no 10 who we normally play as a left-half in front of the worst defender in the league (even if Cissoko had not been relegated with Villa). And we have not one player even remotely with the authority to control and adapt to the emerging events on the pitch. We'll probably get to at least one cup final every two years, but we'll not challenge for the league for another decade, at least.

Still proud to be a red though, but then I'm old enough to remember 30/40 years ago.

 

Judging from your picture you have aged very well

 

Me too - and that experience tells me is that it's really impossible to predict what will happen. It really only needs a few things to fall into place and everything can change almost overnight, and you don't often see it coming.
Trying to predict if, when and how we can get back to the top is pointless imo, although it gives us something to talk about.

If we just all keep saying next year is our year, one day we just all might be right.

 

That's weekend Donga. taken some years back though, and in Ukraine. And before I had the kids and the bastard left me for his younger secretary.

 

We have the capacity to compete like any other team.

We have the money to build a team.

We have a quality manager who gets to build that team as far as we've been told.

Winning a league takes quality sure...but it also takes a bit of luck: having a consistent team relatively free of injury. Moments going your way in those few key games where you don't play well...this needs the right mentality which we don't have pre summer.

You also need other teams challenging to slip up...not many teams go the whole season unbeaten..if they do, they win and not much you can do about that.

I've said this for years...if you are going to give a manager 3 years then let him build with the players he wants. Be that they cost 3 million or 50 million. You can't make players join us but if they want to come don't let a chart overrule the manager you've paid to do the job. Judge at the end (unless it's a complete disaster).

Up until now when you tot up the money spent it looks a huge amount and it is but every year we spend roughly the same money per player to get the exact player we already had. With the odd ridiculous huge money spent on a panic buy...

I like Klopp. I think he can build a confident strong minded team that play with energy and flair. That will give us a fighting chance to compete for titles...whether we win one or not...who knows?

 

If you look at improvement in terms of points... 4th this season was 66 - we got 60.

Now, this was a freak (very poor) season in terms of quality. We should aim for 70 points for 4th next season IMO.

Can we make those 10 points up?

- No Europe
- Fit Sturridge
- Klopp for entire season
- Trusting Klopp + club to make better signings

It's fair to say Klopp will improve our results. It's fair to *assume* our signings can only get better. Rodgers was awful in the market and Klopp is one of the best.

I imagine we can make 70 points if three or four of the above come true.

The problem will be Chelsea, United and Spurs - the league is in an unprecedented state of flux. We could all improve or fail.

So really this is a great time to reassert ourselves. We have a good model for stability with Klopp as he's a manager who likes to stick around and improve the club. So if he's successful we will reap the rewards. Look at Dortmund now with Tuchel - still benefiting from Klopp.

The fixtures will be crucial... United and Chelsea will be praying for easy starts to build momentum.

 

Frankly if this year proves anything it proves solid defence gets you up the table.

West ham.. solid... bit hooey but there you go.
Leicester.. solid enough is unique occasion.
Spurs very solid.

Southampton, poor fir a period but very good late on.

Utd solid in large parts.

Biggest floppy arsenal and city... not solid at all.

Anyway.... that 10 points... easily made up by better defending.

 

This is what I'm really hoping on this summer. Problem with Rodgers in the market it never looked like he knew what he was doing or who he really wanted and with no prior knowledge of how to handle a bigger budget, add to the fact nobody was sure who was in charge. Made us have a scatter gun approach towards transfers, buying misfits, overspending and whoever the media linked us to.

Klopp's refusal to spend in Jan makes me think he has a more measured approach to transfers. Took the time to look at all the players in the squad and work out who wanted and where to strengthen. The fact we're finally being linked (and Looking at) Goalkeepers and Central defenders means someone has finally realised where we're weak.

 

I do think that had Rogers got his way over Williams:

a) We'd have won the league in '14.

b) We'd have a leader now.

 

My view is that we will not easily get ALL sections of the team performing at the very highest levels. But what can be done is make sure that no area is weak. GK defence, DM, AM and strike force.

For me all the title winning teams apart from having no weak sections, have at least one player who is at the top of the league - a POTY contender (Toure, hazard, Mahrez) and around whom the team could be built. Consistency (few injuries and suspensions ) of selection will be key.

So we have to get that player by hook or by crook. A player like that won't be cheap. For me, we should spend the huge part of the budget on one star player instead of spending it on several £10m-£15m players. Coutinho is too inconsistent and sturridge is too prone to injuries. Firmino, can, Allen, lallana or Milner are not such players. But they all could be improved and energised by the presence of a superstar.

 

Hmmm, really not sure about that.
It is one way to go about it, but I don't think it's any more likely to succeed than a well balanced team of good players without a superstar.
Two years ago Suarez comfortably outperformed all rivals but we could still only make second. Aguero alone can't lift City above (what is for them, considering their resources) the mundane and half -hearted stuff we've seen from them too often.
I still believe it's about the team, and the only individual that matters as such is the manager.

 

Klopp signed plenty of great players for £10-15m or under for Dortmund who turned out to be stars. Reus, Aubameyang, Gundogan, Hummels, Lewandowski etc. All arguably world class and all bought for pretty tiny fees considering their talent.

The only question is do we have time to let players like this develop, and would Klopp get the patience and time from the club and the fans to let these players grow.

 

All big clubs across Europe have good scouting systems. Most outstanding players are in great demand and won't be cheap. The likes of reus hummels will not be sold for £10m-£15m anymore. Even potential costs huge these days. Someone with potential like Martial could cost more than £40m.

i am not sure about buying potential and players with resale value. We've been chasing our tails for decades. We have to buy for now as all the top clubs are reinforcing thrust squads.

 

This is why we have to trust klopp if he buys a younger guy.

Aubameyang played wide for dortmund d under klopp til lewandowski moved. Then he exploded.

Origi might be played wide... we might buy that 20 year old cb... who knows.

But in the end we have to wait a few years to see it.

 

Every two-bit club across Europe (and more) are rubbing their hands with glee at the idea of a Premier League club coming along and buying their £5/10m players for £15/20m. They've all heard about the new TV money, and they're all like estate agents showing off lottery winners (or Mark Clattenburg before a Unitard game) around a mansion. There'll be **** all 'cheap' in Europe this year because even the 'frees' will be looking for massive wages.