Off Topic Migrant crisis

Maybe with the spaniards but used often over here, not in a detrimental way either.

 

Oh. In the old Westerns it was a bit detrimental. Hollywood, I suppose.

 

Just listened to Sunak claiming credit for the Rwanda plan. It was actually Boris's idea.

 

Not in the Conservatives' 2019 GE manifesto either.
If it had been I would not have voted for Johnson, despite the temptation of the one reason that I did so (getting Brexit done).

The policy not being in the 2019 manifesto is also the reason why the House of Lords feels it is free to oppose the Rwanda bill to the fullest extent of its ability.
Ultimately it will fail one way or another; either by giving way voluntarily in the end, or the Commons using its executive powers.
Which it rightly has of course, being the elected chamber.

I expect the Rwanda bill to be Law by tomorrow morning.
It will be a day of the deepest shame for this Country.
And I look forward to an incoming Labour (or Labour/Lib Dem Coalition) Government scrapping it.

 

Let’s see what happens IF the planes eventually start taking off. Will it affect the numbers arriving ? I have no idea, but it’s worth a try. And does anyone else have a better idea to lower the numbers of illegal migrants ?

 

The Rwanda bill has passed.

This morning there is a New United Kingdom, where the Government is omnipotent.
Nothing it does can be defined as illegal anymore.
The Supreme Court may as well be dissolved. Total executive authority now resides in No.10 and the Home Office.

Rishi Sunak is no longer merely Prime Minister. He is all-powerful.
One Nation, one People, one Leader.

 

Does this mean we stop granting asylum to those fleeing Rwanda?

 

Apparently the Rwanda project will only deal with 1% of the illegal migrants and at a ridiculous cost - it’s just a last gasp attempt to win votes by the tories

 

The Rwanda will do nothing to stop them coming. The issue I have is that this is masking the real problem, which is immigration in general. Last year net migration ran at 672000. This means as a country we have to provide services, education, housing and general infrastructure for a population twice that of Bromley (330000) every year this continues. Clearly this is unsustainable. Now I am not an extreme right winger, far from it. In general I hold slightly left of centre views. When the time comes for the election, if any of the political parties knock on my door I will be asking them what they are going to do about this. Now it won't really affect me, but it definitely will affect my grandchildren and possibly my children. I really wish we could have a period of pragmatic government where decisions were taken on merit not on ideology. To my mind this is one of the failings of our election system. My vote has never really counted for anything as I live in a constituency where generally the Conservatives could put up a monkey and it would get elected. There rant over.

 

Sorry Lardi, but this is the most ridiculous post I have ever seen you make on here.

By a very long way.

 

That would depend on the facts of the case.

 

It’s an attempt to have a deterrent.

It doesn’t matter how many will actually be deported to Rwanda. The idea is to send a message that just because you make it to these shores, it doesn’t mean you get to stay here even if you have absolutely no legal right to do so.

Is it also an attempt to win votes ? Almost certainly, yes. But isn’t every policy of every party in the UK the same. It’s the aim of democracy isn’t it ?

 

Welcome dzc10.

Yep, I can agree with every word of that.

But although it won’t stop them coming, if it is implemented and expanded then it will reduce the numbers coming. And that’s a start. Of course it’s a big IF because it will still be challenged at every possible stage and we don’t know what a future Labour government will do with it.

But without the French helping us to turn the boats back at sea, it still all comes back to “what is the alternative.”

 

Thank you, since the whole situation is utterly ridiculous.

Rwanda was not a safe Country. The Supreme Court ruled as much.
Now Rwanda is a safe Country.
At the stroke of a quill on vellum.
The Government says it. The Leader says it. Now the Law of the Land says it.

We have truly entered the Twilight Zone
So the mass rounding up and detention of foreign criminals should begin in the next day or so.
On camera hopefully, to send out that message of deterrence.

 

And in case anyone hasn’t seen this mornings news, four would-be illegal immigrants and an innocent four year old child have drowned while trying to cross the channel in a small boat from France.

This is on the hands of the French authorities, who are actively encouraging people to try to make the crossing to England from France, in boats they know are not capable of making it.

Shameful and blatantly self-defeating.

 

Although the situation is indeed ridiculous it can’t just be ignored.

It needs to be dealt with.

And again I’ll ask for the umpteenth time, without cooperation from the French, how do we deal with it ? How do we deter illegal immigrants from trying to come here ?

 

In the last 14 years the number of forced evictions of failed asylum seekers has gone down by 70%. But it's become a political football, which usually favours the Conservative party, so they will keep it in the news and keep repeating the dishonest phrase "Labour's Open-door policy". Or maybe I'm just an old lefty. Anyway I've given my views on the situation several times so no point repeating them.

 

Mass migration to this country was started by the Tories, was reinforced by Blair’s Labour and cemented by the Tories since then.

They are all to blame. It isn’t party politics. It’s a betrayal of ordinary British people by the elites.

But it’s ordinary British people that are stupid enough to elect the elites, so ultimately it’s down to everyone who voted Tory or Labour during that time.

 

The first-past-the-post system is largely to blame. Under PR there would be more point in voting for parties like Reform or The Greens.

 

I have less of a problem with the Reform UK solution to be honest.
As explained on QT last week.
Tow the boats back to France - which Reform says we have the right to do under some International treaties that I'm not aware of.
That should be easier than it once was, as the boats are now more often very large rather than tiny inflatables.
Or if towing the vessels is too risky, then take the people off their boats (as is done now) and then take them back to France in our rescue / patrol vessels.

Not saying I like the idea.
But I dislike it less than I dislike the Rwanda policy.

There are no neat and tidy solutions to this issue.
But if it's a lesser of two evils I would rather see hundreds of patrol vessels on the English Channel night and day, than the spectacle of people being rounded up off the streets and out of hotels, to be interned and then forced onto a flight to Africa.

The best way to stop the boats is to stop them.
Not hope that the people getting into them might get discouraged when a few hundred other people get flown to Rwanda.
That is very wishful thinking.
I can scarcely believe I'm beginning to contemplate the Reform UK solution. But then as mentioned, we are in the Twilight Zone now.
A strange parallel universe where compassion and humanity are luxuries of a bygone era.