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Rival watch

Discussion in 'Tottenham Hotspur' started by Lovearsenalcock, Jan 2, 2012.

  1. Citizen Kane

    Citizen Kane Danny Rosebud

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    There's no doubt they need a bit of a clear-out, albeit none of the outgoings will fetch much. Mignolet, Moreno, Lovren, Lucas, Can, Sturridge, Ings, Origi are all nowhere near title-winning standard (although Origi has a lot of potential to become that). Some of them could be kept on for squad depth but I can see at least 4 moving on, 4 brought in.
     
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  2. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member
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    They made a mistake with that one, in my opinion.
    Brought in Cuadrado to replace Salah and Schurrle. Both are better than him, for me.

    They made a few slip ups in the transfer market that season though, I think.
    Selling Lukaku and bringing in Remy looks like poor business, for a start.
    They won the title, though. They can afford to **** up quite a bit and get away with it.
     
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  3. The Serious Guy

    The Serious Guy Active Member

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    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/40348340

    Because obviously two teams bearing the same imposed name taken over in the same style with the same kit colours and in the habit of transfering players between themselves have absolutely no conflict of interest whatsoever. UEFA sellouts. Just another example of a rule being well and good until it gets in the way of a bit of profit.
     
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  4. humanbeingincroydon

    humanbeingincroydon Well-Known Member

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    #43224
  5. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member
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    Are any of those accused of tax dodging while playing for Barca or Real actually going to be Spanish?
    Ronaldo, Neymar, Messi, Di Maria, Mourinho, Mascherano... it's uncanny, isn't it?
     
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  6. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    How are footballers who are Spanish nationals taxed ??
    On paper it should be uniform (in which case said players may merely
    being paid much more in wages) .
     
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  7. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member
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    It all seems to be about some sort of image rights dodge, where they're getting paid into overseas accounts.
    I'm not sure if the nationality of the individual makes any difference, to be honest.
     
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  8. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    Nationality might be the issue (or difference) .
    Perhaps a Spanish national has a lot more aggro to try and
    establish the more "exotic" offshore schemes that all the accused
    seem to be using.

    I find the "Beckham Law" much more interesting though
    (it explains some things - the current inequitable distribution
    of TV rights money in La Liga etc) .
     
    #43228
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  9. humanbeingincroydon

    humanbeingincroydon Well-Known Member

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    There's another way of looking at it, namely their agents...
    The Oily Rat - Jorge Mendes
    Neymar - Juan Figer
    Messi - Jorge Messi
    Di Maria - Jorge Mendes
    Moronho - Jorge Mendes
    Mascherano - Pinas Zahavi

    Anyone seeing a pattern here?
     
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  10. PleaseNotPoll

    PleaseNotPoll Well-Known Member
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    So don't get an agent if he has a Spanish name starting with J or if he's named after genitals? Sounds good. <ok>
     
    #43230
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  11. humanbeingincroydon

    humanbeingincroydon Well-Known Member

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    #43231
  12. Diego

    Diego Lone Ranger

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    5 out of 6 have an agent who's first name starts with J?
     
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  13. humanbeingincroydon

    humanbeingincroydon Well-Known Member

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    Three out of five have passed through a club with the initials MU?
     
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  14. Diego

    Diego Lone Ranger

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    Uncanny the links that can be found when you try :emoticon-0100-smile
     
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  15. Diego

    Diego Lone Ranger

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    I have just discovered that all 6 of them have been involved in games against Villarreal :bandit:
     
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  16. Citizen Kane

    Citizen Kane Danny Rosebud

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    Correct. The watershed moment was when the Beckham Law was effectively scrapped in 2010 when the recession began to really suffocate the Spanish economy. From 2003 until that point, professional footballers could opt to pay non-domicile tax rates of just under 25% on all image-rights income. In 2010 this was scrapped for players earning more than 600,000Euro p.a. on those rights (most top players earn far, far more than this via various sponsorship deals and endorsements), which is why most of the allegations trace back to the 2011 tax year onwards. (As a side note, the Beckham Law was scrapped entirely for all professional footballers as of Jan 2015, as the courts began wising up to the fact that the overwhelming majority of players who play for Real & Barca are cheating bastards both on and off the pitch).

    The controversy has arisen because all of the aforementioned players/manager have registered various offshore smoke n mirror 'companies' through which they funnel income related to image rights. Since the 'fall' of the Beckham Law, these monies should be subjected to the usual tax rate of 51% for top earners (ironically this is actually 56% in Catalonia). The accusation is that Messi, Ronaldo, Maureen etc. failed to fully declare image-related earnings, quite literally making up percentages of how much of said income was 'earned on Spanish soil' and how much was not.

    The prosecution is arguing (quite sensibly) that since the overwhelming majority of said image's physical exposure was accomplished playing in Spain and for a Spanish employer, image-rights should legally be considered equivalent to money earned on Spanish soil and thus taxable at the full rate as per normal salaries - irrespective of how many mickey mouse accounts the money visits before being spent on champagne, cars and egocentric statues.

    The defense is arguing (somewhat less sensibly, although I do see their point) that the totally globalised nature of the game and exposure of said image makes it impossible to trace the fiscal gain of said image to any particular sovereign state, and the bulk of these monies are therefore regarded as if earned 'overseas' and not taxable under Spanish law. There is some sense behind this argument as - for example - Messi is paid millions a year to wear Adidas boots because the executives at Adidas anticipate that he will be wearing them while playing Germany or France in the World Cup and will be seen by an audience of hundreds of millions. Messi wearing Adidas boots against Granada understandably attracts far less interest and QED that 'image' is worth far less in Adidas' eyes.

    The reason why the defense's argument is doomed to fail is that they are simply regurgitating the logic of the Beckham Law (at the time of his move to Real, his lawyers correctly pointed out that he was an already-established mega-brand and should therefore be exempt from the highest rate of tax). The Spanish government very generously opened that particular loophole during the years of plenty. But it has now been irrevocably closed. Don't like it? Piss off and go play elsewhere.
     
    #43236
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  17. The Changing Man

    The Changing Man Well-Known Member

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  18. paultheplug

    paultheplug Well-Known Member

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    I believe that Spanish tax laws demand that if you spend 183 days in Spain during the tax year ( Jan 1 - Dec 31) you must pay tax on worldwide earnings to Spain. I actually earn all my income outside Spain but still have to pay all taxes here and none anywhere else. Perhaps Pete, the resident tax expert, would know more about how this would affect the super rich.
     
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  19. NotSoMightyEastbourneBoro

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    In these days of global business, brands and what have you then you have to make tax laws as simple as possible. Therefore it is perfectly logical for the Spanish authorities to say you pay tax on all income related to your job while you are employed and work in that country. Sure, it is not black and white anymore but nothing ever is. They have to do the best they can. You are employed by Real Madrid/Barcelona who are Spanish 'businesses' then you meet the requirements of those countries tax laws. Simple as. Sure, you could say that money earned from your international duties is different but that way lies madness. Maybe they should say that 'Ok, X% of your games played this season were for Argentina so X% of your image rights tax goes to Portugal/Argentina/Brazil'.

    End of the day, players agents are greedy bastards. They already avoid a hell of a lot of tax by setting up companies and the like so all wages and the like are paid to a company rather than an individual so anything else they get up to is unforgivable, especially considering the current financial struggles of everybody else.
     
    #43239
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  20. The RDBD

    The RDBD Well-Known Member

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    You could also factor in the likely audience who view your "image" .
    Broadcast companies have reasonable data on viewing audience size for each game etc.


    "End of the day, players agents are greedy bastards. ..."

    This is a moral issue.
    And as morality is subjective, you are unlikely to get a global
    resolution on this one.
     
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