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BREAKING NEWS: EUROPEAN SUPER LEAGUE

Discussion in 'Liverpool' started by moreinjuredthanowen, Apr 18, 2021.

  1. moreinjuredthanowen

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    If fans were willing to put a pot of 2-300million together to buy 10% stage or whatever work away. no issue. it then needs board representation.

    they failed to raise money in 2009 to buy the thing, but it was never realistic. If they had 200mil back then in a fan group they whole history could be radically different.

    I mean the arsenal fans seem to be happy with some billionaire working with the 3 players who see it as a power grab to come in to arsenal.
     
    #1401
  2. johnsonsbaby

    johnsonsbaby Well-Known Member

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    The fans have in effect just vetoed the ESL. They didn't need a seat on the board (with or without voting rights) or advisory roles in order to do that. What they are trying to do is formalise their position in some way. Why is that pointless?

    To keep springing surprises which are quickly shot down can be circumvented. To do that the club will need some kind of fan involvement. Unless, of course, they like the repeated public humiliation and climbdowns.
     
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  3. Darwinism

    Darwinism Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely. The supporters rep on the board may not affect the decision but it will bring anything suspicious to light and to a wider audience. The element of surprise won’t be there anymore...hopefully.
     
    #1403
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  4. Bumps

    Bumps Well-Known Member

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    Unless they pay the supporters rep :bandit:<whistle>
     
    #1404
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  5. Bumps

    Bumps Well-Known Member

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    Now I may be over simplifying this as I don’t have the business acumen of some on her however it looks to me like the argument over the ESL is some clubs who to be fair and honest have worked at increasing and sorting their fan base out - with utd and Madrid being the behemoths.

    Football is not a level playing field none of the mill towns in lancs will ever be as big as a city based club imho just down to logistics (which is how you end up with lots of plastics I think)

    So their argument is why should other clubs who don’t put as much in as they do be given equal pie ?

    so why can every match not be televised and put out to bid for and the money paid for each match be equally split between the two sides involved ?
     
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  6. Tobes

    Tobes Warden
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    Agree completely, I’d feel the same about some of the more vocal Blues fan group members. It’s got a real whiff of animal farm about it....

    Meaningful fan consultation should be mandated on issues of key importance imo though, a list of which could be drawn up by either the league or a regulatory body. Ultimately stopping something like the plot to create the ESL ever happening again is definitely going to need amendments to the rules (which the PL have already stated they’re on with).

    Had consultation happened around the idea of the ESL then it’d have never got beyond the embryonic stage as it’d have been pulled to pieces, which is exactly why they didn’t seek it.
     
    #1406
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  7. RogerisontheHunt

    RogerisontheHunt Well-Known Member

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  8. Tobes

    Tobes Warden
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    In what way do the smaller clubs in the league put less in to the competition?

    It’s this premise that is at the heart of the problem imo. Big clubs have dipped out of the PL over the years, teams that had either won the comp or been European regulars (and winners) examples being - Newcastle, Leeds, Blackburn, Sunderland, Forest and Villa. The league didn’t suffer a jot as a result, if Arsenal or Spurs got relegated would the league collapse? Would it ****.

    What’s happened in recent years is that the self anointed ‘Big 6’ have tried to use their collective power to strong arm the rest. With the intimation always being that ‘you can’t survive without us’, that cartel needs to end.
     
    #1408
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  9. johnsonsbaby

    johnsonsbaby Well-Known Member

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    I'm at the stage now where I just laugh and shake my head at millionaires talking about money ruining anything.
     
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  10. johnsonsbaby

    johnsonsbaby Well-Known Member

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    I don't think the big clubs object to sharing the money. They just want to be able to make more for themselves.
     
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  11. Darwinism

    Darwinism Well-Known Member

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    Many of those go “native”. It’s human nature.
     
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  12. moreinjuredthanowen

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    Or let everton back in ;)

    Seriously though it is a little construct of the media as the names have changed


    One might say a cartel of 14 nobodies holding the prem back is also bad for football ;)
     
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  13. Tobes

    Tobes Warden
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    Only it’s not a construct of the media. The current big 6 had their own collective agenda items at the PL meetings, they acted as one, as they knew their power as individuals meant little, but as a collective it was more meaningful.
     
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  14. Tobes

    Tobes Warden
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    Project big picture was literally the big 6 wanting to rewrite the split of the pot to suit themselves. Under that plan the disparity between the highest and lowest earners in the league would have been massively exacerbated. So it was most definitely about wanting a bigger slice and not merely making a bigger cake.
     
    #1414
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  15. moreinjuredthanowen

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    Yes they did, the point is it was different in 1992, would be different in 2000 or 2010 and today contains two absolute hanger ons in spurs and arsenal form a playing point of view.

    Their mistake imo is they didnt widen the circle slightly cos theres plenty of greed that would like to jump in there.
     
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  16. moreinjuredthanowen

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    It was daylight robbery right enough.

    Imo it was a bigger disgrace from a premier league point of view than an esl. The only difference is the prem have a contract signing to hold over them this time.
     
    #1416
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  17. Tobes

    Tobes Warden
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    The prime differences to 1990 and that original meeting called by LWT, was that the first thing those invited clubs did post that meeting was to speak to the FA, and was driven with their support from the off. Plus, the rebranding of the top flight together with exposing it to live TV on a major scale, didn’t change the basic premise of the football pyramid.

    The mistake with the ESL was thinking that the entire idea of a closed shop, completely self serving league was somehow what the punters actually wanted and was going to be of benefit to the game itself. It’s truly incredulous that they believed they could somehow impose the idea on their own fanbases and they’d swallow it. It highlighted with aplomb just how out of touch the leaders of the clubs who drove that project actually are. Many of them rarely even attend a game ffs.
     
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  18. johnsonsbaby

    johnsonsbaby Well-Known Member

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    Project Big Picture was a different proposition to the super league which is what I was responding to.

    Philip Carter, Everton's chairman, pushed for a breakaway league for 10 years before it actually came about because he didn't want to share the money down. 1992 started the rot.
     
    #1418
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  19. moreinjuredthanowen

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    And we were complicit as were others.

    It's not about morally right, it's about the club members (14) holding the others in. The reality is if West ham for example we're not naval gazers who think survival is great they might think their 60k stadium in London entitles them to join the 6.

    I won't mention Leicester or Everton in that.

    The magic number to wrest control is 14. Its easier for 14 to think small and hold 6 back than 8 or 10 to think big and try bring 4 along with them.

    Say we had a situation where say 10 thought a new format for the prem with 16 teams in it and a massive post season knock out tournanent (just making this up now).

    Now the 10 would need 4 of the other 10 to vote to disenfranchise 4 clubs. They would be turkeys voting for Christmas. Who of the 10 lower half teams would vote for a club reduction?

    None.

    Would you or I be interested in an American style post season blast for the top say 8 in qf, so and a grand final? I don't know.

    However we will never know as the 14 are so afraid of losing power and risking further creep to the big clubs that they would never ever accept it.

    "Big clubs" have talked 18 team top theirs for age but it doesn't happen and so uefa pack in more and more midweek games and player now last 5/6 years before burn out not 10 or 12.

    No turkey will ever vote for Christmas:)

    I could imagine a 16 team league with a post season knock out could make even more money for the side who can stay in it but the risk of not being in will always scare off the rest.

    It took 3? Years after the prem was form to get shut of 2 teams to get to 20. Same story.
     
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  20. Tobes

    Tobes Warden
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    Phillip Carter lead the TV negotiating team for the entire football league in 1985 and agreed a package of live and recorded games with ITV, which was then rejected by the old guard Chairmen in the pyramid.

    He then became the President of the football league.

    Quite why you’ve felt the need to bring him up in the context of the discussion is beyond me.
     
    #1420

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