Match Day Thread Huddersfield Town vs Arsenal - Matchday Thread

Truly dreadful performance. We are just nowhere near good enough on the ball. If Ozil is a liability defensively then Torreira is the same offensively. Can't seem to hold onto the ball at all going forward. Iwobi has buffed up so he is slightly better defensively, but his foot speed is so slow now that he can't seem to dribble or pass unless he has lots of time, which he isn't going to get. Mikhy looked the best on the ball and he isn't that good, and his legs seem to go after 30minutes. Maitland-Niles looked like Beckham in this team. Ghendouzi is the one bright spark for me. Emery will probably drop him soon.

Thought Huddersfield were the better team today. Soon you guys are going to see it. Strengthening the defence isn't going to a bit of good, if we keep turning the ball over in the middle. The best defence in the world isn't going to stop 10-20 transition give-aways in a game, even if we get two full-backs that don't hare forward.

Besides which, it isn't entertaining watching the team play like Stoke City used to. And I don't want any complaints out of any of you. You are the ****ers, who begged for this ****.

 

I don’t think we play like stoke used to, that’s a bit much.

And in the last 3 years under Wenger, we completely lost our playing style and identity...so it’s not like sticking with him would have made us play more attractive football.

 

As an overall statement though, I’m sick of seeing people say things like “grass isn’t always greener” or “why even get rid of Wenger” (not only here but on Twitter etc)

Regardless of any of the current goings on at the club, Wenger needed to go - he was passed it as a manager, and I still don’t for one second regret him leaving.

 

Even with the 3 points, I feel like we have lost

 

Agree about Ozil but if you think adding TOP class defenders ahead of Mustafi etc.. won't make any difference you have to be ****ing insane. He was Championship level at best today.

 

I explained it to you. Not my fault if you can't understand it. It seems childishly simple to me. It is after all why people play the press, because turnovers in the opposition half are the best way to score goals. You catch the opposition defence flat-footed and make any defenders they have look silly.

So if pressing is good, then defending against the press is good. You need to retain possession and be able to move the fall forward without giving it away in your own half. Otherwise, it is your defence that looks silly. We have committed all out to midfielders who can press, and we can't move the ball through midfield very well ourselves. We consistently give up more turnovers than we win.

Getting better defenders to deal with turnovers better, is treating the symptom, not the disease. Maybe you can get some defenders that don't look quite as silly when we are caught flat-footed, but you still are going to be trying to beat the odds in every game, because the other team are still starting with more of the best opportunities to score than we are. Obviously the better teams are going to put them away better, but we even when we win, like today, it still isn't going to look good.

Why is that "Insanity"? Is it really too complex to understand?

Oh yes, And I think Wenger had to go, I'm talking about all you people who were bleating for ultra-defensive midfielders. Well, you got 'em, why are you still complaining?

 

I only saw the highlights on MOTD, we looked average at best, but 3 points away will give the team confidence.

 

I hope you are right, but a lot of fans were highly critical of the performance yesterday (rightly so). We've reached 50 points 5 games quicker than last season and have more away wins already than we did for the entirety of last season, which are also positives.

However, we can't perform like that ever again. It's only because of Huddersfield's lack of attacking threat that we weren't punished more severely. Even Fulham would have beaten us yesterday, in my opinion.

The goal we conceded at the end was a sickener, though. I just don't see why it is so hard to keep clean sheets. Against Cardiff, Newcastle and Huddersfield we have conceded goals in injury time.

My worry is the top 4 is so tight that it could genuinely come down to goal difference. Those last-minute goals we've conceded could be huge in determining whether we get that additional £40m to our transfer budget or whether we don't.

I still maintain our best shot of CL football is through the Europa League, but facts are we are 1 point off Manchester United in 4th, so we're still in with a shout.

I hope Emery learns his lesson to not set up so defensively away from home against poor sides.

 

As I've already stated.. I undertsand what you are saying. I just disagree.

We had years of a possession based system under Wenger - In fact it was our longest trophyless spell in our recent history. A midfilefd with Fabregas, Rosicky, Hleb etc.. were ultimately let down by poor individuals at the back. This is still the case. Wenger always valued defenders who could retain the ball over defenders who would well.. defend. Mustafi and Kolasinac are prime examples of this.

There are PLENTY of successful sides throughout history who have valued defensive shape, physicality, aggression and organisation over ball retention . Emery is clearly trying to build a counter attacking side and has stated in the past that he's not interested in possession statistics.

It works both ways. I dont disagree that we need to keep the ball better, tactically there's still alot of work to be done. But I am 100% confident our defensive record would SIGNIFICANTLY improve with better individuals at the back.

 

You only need to look at van Dijk's influence at Liverpool to know how much of an impact a world-class leader at the back can have to your defence and how that permeates throughout the rest of the team.

They've gotten to a Champions League final and are currently top of the league since he signed for them. That's no coincidence.

 

No idea who Muric is but the other six on City's bench would all walk into our first XI and probably be almost best in their position. Sad times.

 

I don't care how long they hold possession for, they can play as direct as they like, Leicester won a league like that and had lousy possession numbers. I'm just saying don't give the ball away in our half. That is not optional. They have to have the basic ball skills to bring the ball out of defence and right now we don't have that. Other teams are pressing us in our own half and we don't have the-ball skills to get it out. Torreira is an absolute liability. He is too easily shrugged off the ball and he plays with his head down. He can't see a pass to save his life. Half the time when he wins the ball, he gives it straight back again.

Look at the who-scored summary https://www.whoscored.com/Matches/1...Premier-League-2018-2019-Huddersfield-Arsenal

Arsenal not only "Stole the ball often from the opposition" (Good Defence); they also "Lost possession often" (No Ball retention)". In fact our defence played well because despite the "Large quantity of possession in the opponent's half" Huddersfield had, they were effective at creating goal-scoring opportunities from long-shot situations". Which means our defence managed to hold them at long range.

I don't understand how you can't see it with all the evidence staring you in the face. For 21 years we have never looked at a player who lacked the basic ball skills to play in the Premier League, where you get very little time. Well, now Emery is stacking the team with them. I'm beginning to think he hasn't a clue what he is doing.

 

No it isn't, but he is also very strong passer of the ball, as well as being a strong defender. It took Klopp a very long to find a defender that fit into his team.

Seriously guys, I'm going to keep hammering you on this. A defender makes less than 10 tackles a game. He makes 50 or 100 passes. If he can't pass, he is giving the ball away more than he is winning it. That is why Mertersacker for all his lack of pace was so good. He was a damn good passer.

Pick a defender that is a weak passer and a strong defender, if you want to illustrate your point.

 

If anything those stats show us our attacking players won us the game. We had less shots with a far higher conversion rate.
Also I would argue our midfielders did the bulk of our best defensive work in this and almost every other game this Season.

I would argue Mustafi is too easily shrugged off the ball. Not Torreira.
Also both Torreira and Guendouzi have a passing accuracy of more than 88% this Season - hardly poor! The little Uruguayan is great on the ball. Mustafi at 84%, Lichtsteiner 80% and Kolasinac at 76.5% give the ball away more frequently.

We also have an issue with Leno who is currently leading the EPL 'errors leading to a goal' league.

You are totally missing the mark here. I'm not arguing - we need defenders who cant pass the ball! Nobody is doing that. I've already stated in practically every post it would be better if we kept the ball better. That's fine.

There's alot more to being a good defender than mearly passing the ball though.

 

Yes, but if you can't do that, the rest is useless, in this day and age when everyone is pressing the **** out of everyone else. Even Pep went with a different goalkeeper who was a far worse keeper, just because he was better at playing the ball on the ground. A goalkeeper!!!!!

Similarly, Torreira is useless as a defensive midfielder if he cant hold onto possession and help get the ball out after he has won it. If all he does is pass the ball 10 yards sideways or dribble it into a corner, his defensive skills are useless.

 

But that was an abject failure and necessitated him then buying Ederson a season later.

There has to be a balance. Torreira would be amazing next to Cazorla for example. Complementary units need to be bought, not individuals. But there does a come a point with certain players where you just have to replace with better players. But there also has to be some sort of tactical system that works. We have very few players who are very good. Ozil, Auba, Bellerin, Laca and that's about it. And these players either need to be used to make money (Suarez, Coutinho et al) by selling them, or used to build the team around (Mane, Firmino et al). Ozil is not going to make us any money and therefore should have had the team built around him. Ozil and Auba should be an incredible duo. But they need a supporting cast. We need options for players to pass to. Ozil needs Auba or someone wide. Bellerin would do that on the right. But some wing forwards who offer options are also needed. Further back on the pitch, Torreira and someone next to him like Cazorla would be complementary and amazing but we let Caz go for free. And he's now playing really well week in, week out in Spain. Who knows if he could have coped with the PL demands, but he can cope with La Liga so I think it would be arrogant to suggest he couldn't have coped with PL again. If we fixed the midfield with balance and complementing players it would help out defence no end. But, we also DO need some fundamentally better players at the back. What the heck is someone like Lichsteiner doing at Arsenal? Regardless of strange decisions like that, left back is a must. Tierney maybe? My brother-in-law is a Rangers fan and watches loads of SPL but he's a realist and says Tierney is a better prospect than Robertson was at the same age and stage of career. And at centre-half Koscielny needs replacing and that will just take money.

And where the hell are all our youths? Where's our Kane? Our Alexander-Arnold? We have stop gap youths that play for us when we have injuries. At no point have they ever really looked good enough for the first XI outright. Sigh. Whatever happened to players like Bielik etc who were supposed to be the next-gen but just disappear off the face of the earth? Hopefully Nelson and Smith-Rowe might offer us 'something for nothing' next year.

 

Not sure if you can get away with one passer and one defender anymore. I like Ghendouzi and Xhaka is pretty good and neither seem to be able to compensate for Torreira. Lichsteiner is awful I agree. In this day and age, I think Chambers may be the sort of CB we need. If he doesn't play CB them DM. yet Emery sent him out on loan?

I worry about Emery because he seems to think Torreira is a great player because he presses so well. But the guy does nothing else well at all, and teams have found him out. When he gets the ball all the teams we play are starting to collapse on him because he can't get rid of the ball. It is going to get worse.

Ozil is one of the most effective players we have in combatting the press and Emery doesn't like him. I just don't see what Emery is trying to do. It seems like we are getting worse the more he puts his stamp on the team.

It is very easy to see what is going wrong, but I can't even see what Emery is trying to do. And it is all very well hoping for new great players, I don't even know what kind of CB he could buy. I don't think he would buy Van Dijk if he were available. I think he has lost the dressing room to be honest. Whatever you say about Ozil on the pitch, by all accounts he is a hard worker in training and an absolute professional. If I were a player and the Manager was playing Iwobi over Ozil, I would be wondering if the manager was criminally insane. Particularly as Ozil is tailor-made to defeat the press. And then he doesn't renew Ramsey either. And Sanchez has looked awful when he has come on. WTF is he thinking?

So I have no idea what Emery thinks is good in an attacking midfielder. at least with Wenger, I had a pretty good idea what he wanted and what he was thinking, outdated as he became. I watch Klopp, Pep, Mouriho and I can see a clear tactical plan, as you say, even when it was an abject failure. But Emery doesn't seem to have a plan at all, defensive or offensive.

I hate the fact I can't tell what he is trying to do, at least offensively. Defensively, I see what he wants, but mixed with what? You can't have a game plan that is press to win the ball and then have no idea what to do when you win it.