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The 2016 Champion Hurdle

Discussion in 'Horse Racing' started by OddDog, Nov 15, 2015.

  1. SaveTheHumans

    SaveTheHumans Well-Known Member

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    I missed the post race stuff but I just have been reading Mullins' comments on the Irish racing site and he said that Faugheen left Nichols Canyon for dead in a serious piece of work on Tuesday and he feels he may have ran his race there. Ruby said the horse was hanging a bit most of the way around too but they make no excuses for losing and also praise NC. I wouldn't be suprised if something was wrong with the machine when they check him out tomorrow.
     
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  2. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    For whatever reason he didn't run up to his rating. If he did Nichols Canyon is what a 175 horse and Wicklow Brave a 170+ horse and we know they aren't.

    Fly often went out undercooked to win this race, i remember him scrapping home against Mickhael D'haguent FFS! No doubt he'd have been beaten by NC that day too.

    Some funny comments made about him today (not just on here I mean) but I guess when you've waited 10 races for a horse to get beat... :)
     
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  3. NassauBoard

    NassauBoard Well-Known Member

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    All well and good but how do you explain how he was so much better in his homework than NC? To me he wasn't undercooked today and that is very worrying.
     
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  4. SaveTheHumans

    SaveTheHumans Well-Known Member

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    It's possible he may have burst a blood vessel. That might explain why he was hanging, a sign of tiredness also. Certainly strange he "left him for dead" Tuesday and can't get to him today. Let's see what the next few days bring.
     
    #44
  5. SaveTheHumans

    SaveTheHumans Well-Known Member

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    In fairness today was Wicklow Braves CH. He's been match fit and kept going throughout summer and had that edge. He will be off now for the Winter I would hope, I'm not suprised he was that close up. He's no mug but obviously not the same league as Faugheen on a going day.
     
    #45
  6. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    What's the saying? There not machines!

    I just think its important to remember he wasn't beaten by a scrubber here. NC one of the few Mullins horses you could is actually unheralded. I suppose Faugheen's jumping is the one major concern I'd have, he wasnt fluent today but still only beat 1/2l in the end, finding plenty for pressure.

    I went in again at 2/1, call me mad but I did. We'll see a different horse in March, on better ground they won't see which way he goes.
     
    #46
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  7. Bostonbob

    Bostonbob Well-Known Member

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    Loads of horses improve for seeing a track so what they did mid week may or may not have any bearing on today. At the end of the day Mullins knows the two better than us all.

    Wicklow was definitely race fit so I'm not surprised he was so close. I'd like to see sectionals of the race because it looked to me like NC was allowed to set fractions that suited his style. That's always going to happen in races like these, especially when the best three are all trained by one yard. That in itself can bring something like Wicklow Brave into the equation as we know he has competitive flat speed. NC likewise. Does Faugheen have that in his arsenal? I don't know. Last year and the one before we saw a horse dominating from the front and using his massive engine to crush the competition and get them all off the bridle before he was feeling the pinch. I think he is a magnificent galloper. Not a speed horse.

    I'm 100% not buying any suggestions that NC was any fitter than Faugheen by design. In that one yard we have Faugheen, Arctic Fire and then probably NC as their best three hurdlers. We know Arctic Fire was undercooked last week so I'll happily believe both today were also similarly in need of a run. All three owned by different connections.

    So, basically, they've changed tactics and its caught him out and now everyone knows what they need to do to beat him.
     
    #47
  8. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    Cut the excuses, going into today Faugheen is the Champion Hurdler and unbeaten. He looked like a bull, reminded more of Arkle than of a champion hurdler. Re-watch the race where you see him and NC close together and look at their necks - NC looked fit and trained to the minute, Faugheen looked like he'd just come back from 6 weeks in the Algarve. Mullins had him nowhere near ready today, I know that just by looking at him. Disgraceful and I have no idea what his "tactics" were - this is a Grade 1 race FFS. Akin to AOB treating the 2000 GNS as a pipe opener on the flat <doh>
     
    #48
  9. OddDog

    OddDog Mild mannered janitor
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    Just playing Devil's Advocate here ...................... imagine Faugheen had stayed at home today and The New One had gone across to Ireland to take on Nicholls Canyon, with the same result?

    "Can't even beat the Mullins 2nd string" <laugh>
    "Won't even see which way Faugheen went"
    "Should stay at home and mop up Grade 2s at Haydock"

    Ah but its all different cos it was Faugheen, race not run to suit, ground against him, all be well come March blah blah blah. For the Champion Hurdler that was reminiscent of Binocular in the season after he won the crown <laugh> i.e ****ing RUBBISH
     
    #49
  10. beeforsalmon

    beeforsalmon Well-Known Member

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    You lost me with the 'imagine The New One had went over' <laugh> <ok>
     
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  11. woolcombe-folly007

    woolcombe-folly007 Well-Known Member

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    Am with you on that too Beefy! Him losing today just means we get more money come March <laugh>
     
    #51
  12. woolcombe-folly007

    woolcombe-folly007 Well-Known Member

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    If MTOY returns and cleans up the Fighting Fith in a couple of weeks, will we have a new favourite for the CH
     
    #52
  13. floridaspearl

    floridaspearl Well-Known Member

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    On faugheen, I thought ruby rode a stinker. Maybe one bottle of red wine to many last night. I expect faugheen to hose up next time, so take the 2/1 for the champion all you ante post players.
     
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  14. Gaz Chambers

    Gaz Chambers 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    Arctic Fire 169 <rofl>

    Beaten by Little King Robin, Irving and 11yo Hurricane Fly that season.... very lucky to be 3 from 14 over hurdles, a maiden and 12k novice hurdle among those 3 wins

    Faugheens rating was questionable to say the least at 174
     
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  15. Gaz Chambers

    Gaz Chambers 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    Jezki and TNO ran the best part of a stone below the previous seasons race, Arctic Fires 157 rating going into the race was infinitely more accurate than the 169 we are supposed to believe he suddenly achieved in a falsely run race no less, his scraping home against Monskland 149 confirms this and would put Faugheen on about 163-5 for his Champion Hurdle win, which means he was only 5-6 pounds below his best today
     
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  16. Bostonbob

    Bostonbob Well-Known Member

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    Jezki's Champion Hurdle was a horrible, horrible race. Absolutely terrible. The only horses to win grade ones over hurdles after that race was The New One at Aintree (beating Diakali and Rock On Ruby less than a length - lets allow that to ruminate for a few moments) and Hurricane Fly - again only beating Jezki and Arctic Fire - who you say isn't worth the rating. We also know (and you've said it for 2 years) that the Fly under performs at Cheltenham.

    Faugheen's race was substantially better. Arctic Fire trounced everything bar the eventual winner. I doubt they've ever really run to 174 and 169 but i'd definitely say those marks are closer to reality than the daft numbers TNO and Jezki et al were awarded in their race.
     
    #56
  17. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    Reflecting on Faugheen's defeat, having watched it several times. There is no doubt in my mind that Faugheen is the superior of the two. I'm surprised that no-one (including Mullins) has even mentioned that Faugheen was napping. Basically, he refused to go past his stable mate. It's not that he couldn't, he wouldn't. Had Faugheen made the running he probably would have won head in chest. I can guarantee that they won't race each other with the same tactics again. If they do, it's likely it will end the same..
     
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  18. Gaz Chambers

    Gaz Chambers 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    Jezkis Champion Hurdle was a proper race, the ratings are solid, it was 5 seconds faster than Faugheens on similar ground.

    My Tent ran 3rd in the Scottish Champion off 168 without settling in the race and the winner destroyed Hurricane Fly next time at Punchestown when he was still near his best. The New One won his next 5 races. Ptit Zig went on to be rated 159 as a novice chaser, he was beaten 16L, lets not forget Our Conor who looked a top class young hurdler and wouldnt have been far away.

    To me that was a proper Champion Hurdle, what Arctic Fire and Faugheen would have done in that race I dont know but id bet everything I have they wouldnt be having their own race 6L ahead of Jezki, MTOY and TNO, Faugheens jumping would have been tested that day, dont worry about that.
     
    #58
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2015
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  19. Gaz Chambers

    Gaz Chambers 1 of the top judges in Europe

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    When you watch both races side by side its unbelievable, Faugheen crosses the line with Grumeti in 30L last in the previous years race.
     
    #59
  20. Ron

    Ron Well-Known Member
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    Yes Joe. I'm not convinced that Faugheen is the monster we thought he was. He hadn't beaten much before the Champion Hurdle and, although it was fast, it was (as you say) 5 secs slower than the previous year's. Makes you wonder why Jezki didn't win last season's Champion Hurdle.
     
    #60

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