Off Topic The Politics Thread

Embarrassing.

Shah herself, after her fulsome apology, actually comes better out of this than Livingstone.

No reason you would have got my dumb joke btw.

 

It would be reasonable to assume that this would damage Trump, but it probably won't. Nothing seems to.

 

No to both questions.

I think there is a problem with a minority on the labour far left who have a fixed world view of hating America and Israel.
However, I take your point that criticising Israel does not make you anti semitic.
Some, like Livingston go further though and are undoubtedly anti semitic.

 

delighted the even hand the beeb have played so far in this very important issue. Although the former DG, Lord Patten and Euro fanatic, has urged the BBC to be more partisan. Don't you just love democracy

 

There's a serious side to that question - as taken from Wiki:-

"Born in Bradford, Shah was abandoned by her father when six years old after he ran off with their neighbour's sixteen-year-old daughter. At age 12, she was sent to Pakistan to avoid her mother, Zoora's, violent partner, whom Zoora fatally poisoned because she believed he was planning to sexually abuse her daughters. She served 14 years in prison for his murder. While in Pakistan, Shah was forced into an arranged marriage..."

I've lived a sheltered life.

 

It goes beyond. McDonnell and Co have a history of supporting and justifying violent struggle - IRA, Hamas, Hezbollah etc

 

Yes, I really wish I hadn't posted that.

 

Wasn't picking you up on that, Strolls. Just using it to highlight what seems like another world, to me anyway

 

Doesn't seem to make the US press.

 

I think the lesson that Naz Shah, Ken Livingstone and others need to understand is that whilst it's fine to criticise people, people groups and countries where you feel there are grounds to so do, you need to be aware of the consequences of using language that is inappropriate to the group you are targeting. This is the issue that Labour are having now, and the issue that is coming back to bite those in public office who so vocally berated the Liverpool fans after Hillsborough.

Clearly using words like 'solution' when talking about forcibly relocating the world's jewish population is wrong. Had the word been used when talking about the French, then not so much.

Forced relocation is always going to run the risk of accusations of racism. Imagine if she'd said it about Muslims, or the refugees in Europe, or even Black Americans? That's something not even Donald Trump would say.

Basic rule, regimes are fine, but people groups are probably not. And think before you post or speak, whether you hold office, aspire to hold office, or want to keep your current cushy job in Westminster or elsewhere....

 

My sincere apology. I had not intended my post as insinuating that you are either anti-Semitic or racist. As you said it was a genuine albeit rhetorical question and I gave a genuine opinion to the question asked. I agree entirely that Livingstone's ramblings were mad. The art of conceding gracefully and moving the debate to any valid points they might have is something that few politicians have successfully mastered. Tony Blair was the most notable exception to the rule. It was not until he was brought to account for Iraq that he fell into the political mainstream of never owning up to your mistakes and always trying to tell anyone who cared to listen that you were right and, in fact, always are.

 

No apology needed, Yorkshire.

 

Brexit ahead 51%-49% in the latest poll.

Come On!!!!!!

 

Must have been John Major on the radio this morning!

 

The BBC is always even-handed.