Match Day Thread versus Rotherham

Discussion in 'Plymouth' started by sensiblegreeny, Dec 14, 2017.

  1. Plymborn

    Plymborn Well-Known Member
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    How is it possible for us to lose every time when down to 10 men....but unable to win when playing 10 men ?
     
    #21
  2. sensiblegreeny

    sensiblegreeny Well-Known Member
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    I can forgive losing against 10 men or 11 men. That isn't the problem is it. What I cannot take is the losing without trying to win. I do not accept that putting 10 men behind the ball when playing 10 men with about 15 minutes to go and having got a goal is trying to win. It comes across as sheer panic on Adams part to cling on instead of going on to win. I am getting totally fed up with watching it at home even if I don't at least have to watch it away. How they get over 400 people to part with a shed load of cash for what they are being served up is beyond me. Adams needs to step up or step out.
     
    #22
  3. notDistantGreen

    notDistantGreen Well-Known Member

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    He doesn't play with 2 strikers but one with 2 wide attackers and a No 10. This is what nearly all the top teams do. 4:4:2 is Sunday league nowadays. Get used to it.
     
    #23
  4. notDistantGreen

    notDistantGreen Well-Known Member

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    Long way to go but here's the league table over last 6 games:

    1 Blackburn 6 16 18 9 9 D W W W W W
    2 Scunthorpe 6 15 11 4 7 W W W W W L
    3 Wigan 6 13 12 4 8 W D L W W W
    4 Walsall 6 12 10 5 5 W L L W W W
    5 Bradford 6 12 9 7 2 W L W L W W
    6 Portsmouth 6 12 7 5 2 L W W L W W
    7 Plymouth 6 10 6 7 -1 D W L W L W
    8 Bristol Rvs 6 9 9 7 2 W L L L W W
    9 Gillingham 6 9 7 5 2 W D W D D L
    10 Oldham 6 8 10 7 3 L W D D L W
    11 Charlton 6 8 7 8 -1 W D W L D L
    12 Southend 6 8 5 6 -1 W L D D W L
    13 Doncaster 6 8 4 6 -2 W D D L W L
    14 Oxford 6 7 9 9 0 L L W L D W
    15 Rochdale 6 7 9 10 -1 W D L L W L
    16 Shrewsbury 6 7 4 5 -1 W L W L L D
    17 Northampton 6 7 4 11 -7 W W L L D L
    18 Milton Keynes Dons 6 6 6 8 -2 L W D D L D
    19 AFC Wimbledon 6 5 6 7 -1 L L D W D L
    20 Peterboro 6 5 8 11 -3 D L W L D L
    21 Blackpool 6 5 7 10 -3 L W D D L L
    22 Bury 6 5 3 7 -4 L L D L W D
    23 Rotherham 6 4 7 12 -5 L D L L L W
    24 Fleetwood Town 6 3 4 9 -5 D L D L D L
     
    #24
  5. Plymborn

    Plymborn Well-Known Member
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    Listened to Derek Adams post-match interview.

    Q.....What was your plan when they went down to 10 men.
    A.....We went for it.

    Q.....What positives can you take from this result.
    A.....The positive is we took 1pt.

    Q.....Where does Argyle go from here.
    A.....We have got forward momentum.

    So we responded to them going down to 10 men and yes we did to a degree...but when we scored Rotherham with only 10 players pressurized us and got the goal they needed....taking Taylor off was not necessary to be honest....is Threlkeld out of favour....we couldn't wait for him to return...but he sits on the bench. Songo'o was regularly our best player protecting the defence and really getting stuck in...now he can't get a game....he should have been our first change with Threlkeld also coming on.

    I don't agree that 1pt was a positive outcome...before the match yes....but when they lost a defender and took a striker off to bring another defender on, the situation changed and 3pts were there for the taking...but our inability to score more than one goal will be our undoing if we continue to throw points away like this. How the hell can ordinary Gillingham, who have a poor home record suddenly score 4 goals ?....our goal difference is so bad we need to score an extra point to off-set it....only Northampton have a worse defence than us....doesn't that tell us something about being set up as a counter attacking side with limited speed up front ?...it ain't working Derek....ok we've had injuries...but we've also helped our opposition too many times with red cards.

    We need to struggle along and not lose touch with the teams around us until the January window opens...then we need to do some serious searching for a GOAL SCORER....Ryan Taylor is doing a good job up front and chipping in with the odd goal, but he needs a genuine goal getter to feed off of him....our main source of goals has been Carey....but he isn't consistent enough at Div1 level....he certainly wasn't voted Argyles best player yesterday....you'd think in the second half he would have found more space to play...but it didn't happen. Oscar Threlkeld might of been the player to bring on with some attack ability down one side....personal bringing Wylde on was a doubtful choice. We also need a genuine attacking mid-fielder in the January window...some one who can latch on to Taylor's hard work and feed off his ability to hold up the ball. Most of the time with our defensive set up the ball gets hoofed up field and it comes back with interest...Taylor is helping to overcome that but he needs support,

    The players we need will probably not be freebies...so some serious thought will be needed to find our way through that problem....if we don't get them and continue to play defensive football...we will go down....yesterday because of what happened...we dropped two very valuable points...coming home with 1pt against ten men personally was not a positive result as, you said Mr Adams.
     
    #25
  6. Plymborn

    Plymborn Well-Known Member
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    Good chart there notDistant....especially being able to click on to each team to check their results.....obviously doesn't include Saturdays results....bad result Gillingham winning 4-1 against Bristol R....and also Northampton winning as well.
     
    #26
  7. notDistantGreen

    notDistantGreen Well-Known Member

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    Now that we have Taylor back, our most obvious problem is in the defence, not how many strikers we play. Maybe that's partly due to the revolving door that is the Argyle goal keeping position. No matter how good the individual keepers, understanding is key back there.

    Here are the CB's dropping the keeper in it from a long hopeful hoof v Portsmouth



    and again v Gillingham



    And here's us conceding from a set piece AGAIN v Rotherham



    Taylor-Sinclair probably doesn't deserve to be dropped but Sawyer on the right isn't a good idea. Sticking with a winning side is OK but we need to have Threlkeld on the right and Sawyer on the left,

    As a minimum, we need another striker like Taylor in the transfer window and another right back. Whether we need another CB I don't know, but they need sorting out.
     
    #27
  8. sensiblegreeny

    sensiblegreeny Well-Known Member
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    Adams has got less eyesight than blind Pew. We went for it????????????????? Course we did. What happens when you want to defend against 10 men is attack them and try to get a second goal. What you do not do is sit back yet again and just try to keep them out till the whistle. His sides do that over and over and over and it isn't bleddy working. I personally could not care less what other teams do or don't do. I want Argyle to try to win games and not build a wall to hide behind and hope we nick one. I want Adams to admit just for once what actually happened and not what he hoped would happen. Fact is we dropped 2 points yet again when we could have had all 3. That's what happened Adams not how you dreamt it might have.
     
    #28
  9. notDistantGreen

    notDistantGreen Well-Known Member

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    Revised 6 game performance including the point at Rotherham. Up from 7th to 6th.

    1 Blackburn 6 18 18 7 11 W W W W W W
    2 Portsmouth 6 15 8 4 4 W W L W W W
    3 Wigan 6 13 13 3 10 D L W W W W
    4 Scunthorpe 6 13 10 4 6 W W W W L D
    5 Bradford 6 12 10 8 2 L W L W W W
    6 Plymouth 6 10 6 7 -1 W L W L W D
    7 Oldham 6 9 9 5 4 W D D L W D
    8 Gillingham 6 9 8 5 3 D W D D L W
    9 Walsall 6 9 8 7 1 L L W W W L
    10 Oxford 6 8 9 7 2 L W L D W D
    11 Milton Keynes Dons 6 7 8 8 0 W D D L D D
    12 Shrewsbury 6 7 4 5 -1 L W L L D W
    13 Peterboro 6 7 9 11 -2 L W L D L W
    14 Northampton 6 7 5 12 -7 W L L D L W
    15 Bristol Rvs 6 6 8 11 -3 L L L W W L
    16 Doncaster 6 6 4 7 -3 D D L W L D
    17 Rochdale 6 5 8 10 -2 D L L W L D
    18 Rotherham 6 5 7 10 -3 D L L L W D
    19 Blackpool 6 5 5 8 -3 W D D L L L
    20 Southend 6 5 5 8 -3 L D D W L L
    21 AFC Wimbledon 6 5 6 10 -4 L D W D L L
    22 Charlton 6 5 6 10 -4 D W L D L L
    23 Bury 6 5 2 6 -4 L D L W D L
    24 Fleetwood Town 6 2 4 10 -6 L D L D L L

    For comparison, same thing over 10 games:

    1 Blackburn 10 24 24 10 14 D W D D W W W W W W
    2 Wigan 10 23 22 6 16 W W D W D L W W W W
    3 Scunthorpe 10 20 16 10 6 L D W W W W W W L D
    4 Portsmouth 10 18 11 10 1 W L L L W W L W W W
    5 Gillingham 10 16 14 9 5 W D L W D W D D L W
    6 Bradford 10 16 13 13 0 L D L W L W L W W W
    7 Plymouth 10 16 10 10 0 D D W D W L W L W D
    8 Walsall 10 15 14 10 4 D D D W L L W W W L
    9 Shrewsbury 10 15 11 7 4 D D W W L W L L D W
    10 Charlton 10 15 10 11 -1 W D W W D W L D L L
    11 Oldham 10 14 18 14 4 D D W L W D D L W D
    12 Northampton 10 14 10 16 -6 L D W W W L L D L W
    13 Oxford 10 13 14 13 1 W D D L L W L D W D
    14 Peterboro 10 12 14 16 -2 D L W D L W L D L W
    15 Southend 10 12 8 12 -4 L D W W L D D W L L
    16 Doncaster 10 12 7 12 -5 L W L W D D L W L D
    17 AFC Wimbledon 10 11 10 15 -5 L W W L L D W D L L
    18 Rochdale 10 10 13 15 -2 L D D W D L L W L D
    19 Milton Keynes Dons 10 9 13 17 -4 L D D L W D D L D D
    20 Rotherham 10 9 14 19 -5 W L D L D L L L W D
    21 Bristol Rvs 10 9 10 17 -7 L L L W L L L W W L
    22 Bury 10 8 7 12 -5 W L L L L D L W D L
    23 Blackpool 10 8 10 16 -6 W L L L W D D L L L
    24 Fleetwood Town 10 7 9 14 -5 D L W D L D L D L L

    Now obviously the real table is what counts at the end of the season, but it must be the case that IF we maintain recent performance after an abysmal start to the year, then we must rise out of the drop zone eventually.
     
    #29
  10. sensiblegreeny

    sensiblegreeny Well-Known Member
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    All I can say is you are lucky you don't go every game Notdistant. Yes everyone wants Argyle to rise up the table but it might be nice to have a bit of entertainment sometimes on the way.
     
    #30

  11. notDistantGreen

    notDistantGreen Well-Known Member

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    OK, I've seen the wins against Charlton and Gilligham but was also there for Oxford (lost 0-4) and Doncaster (lost 0-3), so I've seen a fair spread, Bury up next.

    Entertainment would be nice but wins are all I'm really interested in. If we win, I always go home happy. Lose in a thriller and the cat gets it.
     
    #31

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